[OSList] Open Space with Agile: Failure patterns

Arno Baltin arno at tlu.ee
Mon Sep 30 00:09:56 PDT 2013


Thank you, Michael!
It helps, when I know the origin of the saying.

Be well,

Arno



*    *


2013/9/28 Michael Herman <michael at michaelherman.com>

> I learned this phrase in the context of meditation, Arno. I've heard
> meditation teachers say about meditation practice that if we just "do the
> practice" we'll get the results… usually this is in contrast to simply
> talking about the practice or listening to teachings. This is akin to
> saying "anyone with a good head and good heart can do open space…"  anyone
> who does the practice can get the same results that os
> teachers/practitioners, from harrison onward, have gotten.  Does this help?
>
>
>
> On Friday, September 27, 2013, Arno Baltin wrote:
>
>> Hi!
>>
>> I like this conversation about what OS is. And this practice notion is a
>> bit complicated. I as non Enlgish speaker I looked for the meanings of the
>> word and got confused. Could you Michael say it in other words what you
>> mean that OS is practice (first of all). Especially when I read "do the
>> practice" I cant understand the meaning.
>>
>> Be well,
>>
>> Arno
>>
>>
>> *    *
>>
>>
>> 2013/9/25 Michael Herman <michael at michaelherman.com>
>>
>>> When I hear folks simplifying open space into a tool or technique, my
>>> usual response is to point out that circle is a tool, bulletin board is a
>>> tool, etc.  Open Space is a *practice*, incorporating a number of these
>>> different tools.  And hopefully, my use of them together is getting more
>>> and more skillful over time.  To me, "practice" includes the suggestion
>>> that we do it once, as best we can, and then we try again, and again,
>>> learning and refining as we go.
>>>
>>> My felt sense of this is a little different from "values and principles"
>>> though I don't think calling OS or agile or scrum that is incorrect.  For
>>> me the difference is that I hold values and principles, but practice is
>>> something that *holds me*.
>>>
>>> I also like to suggest that open space is a robust practice, a
>>> sufficient practice.  Everything that's needed is there in the basic story
>>> and mechanisms.  We don't need to do anything more, add in different
>>> things.  Just do the practice and we get the experience, get the learning,
>>> the performance, the self-organizing, the breathing.
>>>
>>> Thanks for your story, Harold.
>>>
>>> M
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Michael Herman
>>> Michael Herman Associates
>>> 312-280-7838 (mobile)
>>>
>>> http://MichaelHerman.com
>>> http://OpenSpaceWorld.org
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Sep 23, 2013 at 12:58 PM, Peggy Holman <peggy at peggyholman.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>> Harold,
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for bringing your knowledgable and eloquent perspective.
>>>>
>>>> Great to see these two communities working through an understanding of
>>>> each other.  With you and others as translators, I think Agile is in good
>>>> hands.
>>>>
>>>> Peggy
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>     __________________________________
>>>> Peggy Holman
>>>> Journalism that Matters
>>>> 15347 SE 49th Place
>>>> Bellevue, WA  98006
>>>> 425-746-6274
>>>> www.journalismthatmatters.org
>>>> www.peggyholman.com
>>>> Twitter: @peggyholman
>>>> JTM Twitter: @JTMStream
>>>>
>>>> *Enjoy the award winning* Engaging Emergence: Turning Upheaval into
>>>> Opportunity <http://peggyholman.com/papers/engaging-emergence/>
>>>> Check out my series on what's emerging in the news & information
>>>> ecosystem<http://www.journalismthatmatters.net/the_emerging_news_and_information_eco_system>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sep 23, 2013, at 7:53 AM, Harold Shinsato <harold at SHINSATO.COM>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>  Harrison,
>>>>
>>>> About your statement "Open Space is a terrible way to introduce some
>>>> new process, and especially to assure 'buy in'".
>>>>
>>>> You're clearing going directly against the heart of what Dan is trying
>>>> to promote. Maybe I invite disaster for myself by speaking an alternative
>>>> view from what you are saying given your founding status of this community
>>>> - but perhaps given my 12+ years working in the Agile space - I have
>>>> something worthwhile to say.
>>>>
>>>> Harrison, you've been opposed to calling "Open Space" a tool. And I
>>>> hear Lisa Heft (the best Open Space trainer) talking about it being a tool
>>>> all the time.
>>>>
>>>> I agree with both of you. Open Space is most emphatically *not* a tool
>>>> at it's heart. It's a set of values and principles. But it is also
>>>> definitely a tool. Or as Dan says, a 'game'. A beautifully designed game.
>>>>
>>>> Agile is most DEFINITELY not a process. It's a set of values and
>>>> principles. You can see this in the Agile Manifesto<http://agilemanifesto.org/>- especially the first item, we value Individuals and Interactions *over*
>>>> Processes and Tools. Yes, the Agile community applies many very specific
>>>> tools and processes. And very heated debates happen around the application
>>>> (or misapplication) of those tools and processes, such as Scrum.
>>>>
>>>> But oddly - even Scrum isn't *Really* a tool or a process. At the heart
>>>> of Scrum is also a set of principles and values. If you want to get a sense
>>>> of this - go to the end of the first book on Scrum, by Schwaber & Beedle
>>>> "Agile Software Development with Scrum" - where it lists the 5 values of
>>>> Scrum - Commitment, Focus, Openness, Respect & Courage. Or read Tobias
>>>> Meyer's "The People's Scrum". Very powerful assertion and meditation on the
>>>> core values and how to apply the processes to get
>>>>
>>>> Open Space has already been used with great success to introduce,
>>>> promote and sustain Agile in the world through many uses of Open Space in
>>>> conferences such as the AgileOpen, Coaching Camps, and Open Agile Adoption
>>>> such as what Dan Mezick is explaining. From my vantage point, Open Space is
>>>> critical for helping the values and principles to be successfully absorbed.
>>>>
>>>> From my vantage point - Open Space Technology's values and principles
>>>> are eternal and aren't going away. The Universe won't suddenly stop
>>>> self-organizing. If anything, we'll only get better at understanding and
>>>> dancing with Order and Chaos. This dance, with the help of Open Space
>>>> Technology the Game (or Tool) has changed my life and infused it with
>>>> spirit. I'm eternally grateful to you, Harrison, to Lisa Heft, and to and
>>>> this community. And maybe Open Space Technology the game or tool will pass
>>>> away. The same goes for Agile values and principles. They're eternal.
>>>> They're not going away. The Process will never be more important than the
>>>> Individuals. The People are always more important than the Game.
>>>>
>>>> BUT - there are powerful forces behind trying to adopt agile as merely
>>>> a tool or a process, because it's easier to understand. And that invites
>>>> failure - and it's the exact kind of failure you're writing about,
>>>> Harrison, about how our creations are "inevitably clunky." To succeed, any
>>>> implementation of Agile or Scrum needs to be able to self-organize -
>>>> "Inspect and Adapt" is one of the anthems of the agile and scrum
>>>> communities. I hope that the Open Space community will step up and help the
>>>> Agile community to do that.
>>>>
>>>>     Thanks,
>>>>     Harold
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 9/22/13 10:45 AM, Harrison Owen wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Dan wrote: “I've learned that there are actually more ways to fail with
>>>> Open Space in Agile adoptions than there are ways to succeed. There are
>>>> many ways to stumble when trying this.”****
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Actually, Dan – I am not at all surprised. I learned a long time ago
>>>> that Open Space is a terrible way to introduce some new process, and
>>>> especially to assure “buy in.” Typically, problems arise because folks take
>>>> Open Space seriously. Instead of buying into the proposed process, they
>>>> begin to invent their own! Somewhere I wrote that OS was a great way to
>>>> design a new accounting system, but a horrible way to “implement” it.**
>>>> **
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> And just to be contrarian... I wonder whether the failure is a function
>>>> of Open Space or Agile (and/or the SCRUM flavor of Agile)? As I think we
>>>> have come to understand, Open Space is a total scam if people mistake it
>>>> for some process we invented or “do.” It is simply an invitation to be what
>>>> we always have been – self organizing. The process itself (SO) has been
>>>> around for some time, and apparently has done quite well, witness the fact
>>>> that we, along with all the rest of the Cosmos are here and seemingly
>>>> functional. In a “face off” between a well functioning self-organizing
>>>> system and any process we might have designed to create the system, install
>>>> the system, or enhance the system – the designed process doesn’t have a
>>>> chance. The reason is simple. No matter how wise, careful, diligent or
>>>> skillful we may be – our creation is inevitably clunky. We may get the big
>>>> blocks right, even some of the finer points, but at the end of the day we
>>>> always miss the nuances – and as always, the devil is in the details. Put
>>>> somewhat differently, our designed processes are always “averages” of what
>>>> we think the process should look like. And “averages” do not exist anywhere
>>>> in nature. To push an “average” on a natural system is always to make it
>>>> function at some sub-optimal level, and usually to kill it.****
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> So maybe the order of precedence should go the other way? Use Agile to
>>>> introduce Open Space, and then abolish Agile. Or, if you like ...
>>>> Self-Organization is the natural agility. It doesn’t get any better than
>>>> that. Or something****
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Harrison****
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ****
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Harrison Owen****
>>>>
>>>> 7808 River Falls Dr.****
>>>>
>>>> Potomac, MD 20854****
>>>>
>>>> USA****
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> 189 Beaucaire Ave. (summer)****
>>>>
>>>> Camden, Maine 04843****
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Phone 301-365-2093****
>>>>
>>>> (summer)  207-763-3261****
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> www.openspaceworld.com ****
>>>>
>>>> www.ho-image.com (Personal Website)****
>>>>
>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of
>>>> OSLIST Go to:
>>>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org***
>>>> *
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *From:* oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org [
>>>> mailto:oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org] *On Behalf Of *Daniel
>>>> Mezick
>>>> *Sent:* Thursday, September 19, 2013 11:26 AM
>>>> *To:* oslist at lists.openspacetech.org
>>>> *Subject:* [OSList] Open Space with Agile: Failure patterns****
>>>>
>>>> ** **
>>>>
>>>> Greetings to you,
>>>>
>>>> In Paris this week at the Global Scrum Gathering I plan to issue
>>>> certain warning about specific failure patterns I have experienced when
>>>> working with Open Space inside Agile adoptions. I can tell you right now
>>>> that Open Space by itself is not a panacea for the complex problems
>>>> associated with Agile adoption.
>>>>
>>>> Agile is actually a cover story about the wider act of bringing culture
>>>> change (a new and unfamiliar game) to an enterprise situation (the old
>>>> story we all want to cling to). The SPIRIT book pretty much spells out the
>>>> problem.
>>>>
>>>> I've learned that there are actually more ways to fail with Open Space
>>>> in Agile adoptions than there are ways to succeed. There are many ways to
>>>> stumble when trying this. I'll be enumerating some of these subtle
>>>> Agile-related pitfalls and traps in the Paris keynote on Tuesday, and in
>>>> upcoming blog posts. Simply holding one or more canonical Open Space
>>>> meetings (with full pre-planning and post processing) is not enough to
>>>> neutralize the forces that oppose healthy and well Agile adoptions. The
>>>> game mechanics, storytelling and passage-rite-structure elements must be
>>>> present and robust for Open Space to be an effective tool in Agile
>>>> adoptions. Open Space and these elements are composed in harmony with each
>>>> other in the Open Agile Adoption technique.
>>>>
>>>> If you offer training in Open Space for Facilitators and/or Sponsors, I
>>>> invite you to send me your links and I will make sure they are added to the
>>>> list of resources I am beginning to compile at OpenAgileAdoption.com.
>>>> I plan to list in the Paris slides some specific French-language OST course
>>>> offerings from French-speaking instructors located in Europe, and Quebec.
>>>>
>>>> Kind Regards,
>>>> Dan****
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> ****
>>>>
>>>> Daniel Mezick, President****
>>>>
>>>> New Technology Solutions Inc.****
>>>>
>>>> (203) 915 7248 (cell)****
>>>>
>>>> Bio <http://newtechusa.net/dan-mezick/>. Blog<http://newtechusa.net/blog/>.
>>>> Twitter <http://twitter.com/#%21/danmezick/>. ****
>>>>
>>>> Examine my new book:  The Culture Game
>>>> <http://newtechusa.net/about/the-culture-game-book/>: Tools for the
>>>> Agile Manager.****
>>>>
>>>> Explore Agile Team Training<http://newtechusa.net/services/agile-scrum-training/>and
>>>> Coaching. <http://newtechusa.net/services/agile-scrum-coaching/>****
>>>>
>>>> Explore the Agile Boston <http://newtechusa.net/user-groups/ma/>
>>>> Community. ****
>>>>
>>>>
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>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Harold Shinsato
>>>> harold at shinsato.com
>>>> http://shinsato.com
>>>> twitter: @hajush <http://twitter.com/hajush>
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>>>>
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>>>
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>>
>
> --
> Michael Herman
> MichaelHerman.com
> (312) 280-7838
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
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