[OSList] The OST Game
Lourdes Adriana Diaz-Berrio Doring
adriana at diazberrio.com
Sat Oct 26 11:07:43 PDT 2013
Michael: ULtrech seams to e a place way to far from Montreal but I like the
"?" in a paper idea. Lisa Heft has done several "conversations" in silence
in the wososnos and they were ones of the best ones!
Thank you for this invitation any way!
Adriana
2013/10/26 Michael M Pannwitz <mmpannwitz at gmail.com>
> Adriana and all you others looking for a space to reflect on whatever the
> question might be, consider coming to Utrecht, or better yet: you need to
> come to Utrecht. Its a full blown three day os, no frills attached, exactly
> for the issues people bring along, no matter how clear they are on them...I
> have seen people go to the center, look at the sheets of paper, pick one
> up, stand up in front of the group, dont say a word, go to the bulletin
> board, post it AND have a crowd of people showing up at their session! (One
> of my friends has a slight variation on this, he just puts a "?" on the
> sheet, also draws a crowd). So I know I am never alone with my question.
> I am thinking of this question: How do I excert control and what for? or
> What does control do to me? ... I know I am not alone in this, look at poor
> Ms Merkel being controlled by people listening in on what she talks about
> on her mobile, for some of the stuff she would probably be blacklisted and
> be surprised one day that nobody will hire her.
>
> Right, lets meet in Utrecht or any other place (there are some Basques
> meeting at the same time in Basque country somewhere within Spain),
>
> cheers
> mmp
>
> On 26.10.2013 16:34, Lourdes Adriana Diaz-Berrio Doring wrote:
>
>> Reading your conversation made me think that a very good OS theme would
>> be about how new relationships start, for friends and other types
>> because so many people are using a lot of time looking for some "goal"
>> or "tarjet" in this sites where you ara suposed to find your "soulmate"
>> ...a lot of time is wasted socialy i Think!
>> And there is a need for a space to meet that's for shure.
>> But it would be so nice to have an OS where we could reflect together
>> about this kind of issues about control, surprise, willing to provoque a
>> specific reaction on the other person.
>> But it is not clear in my mind how the question could be framed but I
>> feel there is a need for a space where people having this issues could
>> talk and reflect about this topics. And see also that they are not alone
>> in this.
>> Adriana
>>
>>
>> 2013/10/26 Daniel Mezick <dan at newtechusa.net <mailto:dan at newtechusa.net>>
>>
>> A wonderful conversation in the works...my replies appear below...
>>
>> On 10/24/13 1:29 PM, Jenifer Toksvig wrote:
>>
>>> Dan wrote: >> Consider the man who loves a certain woman, and
>>> waits for the current trend of her interest in him to change. He
>>> is goal seeking without controlling. Likewise, trend-following
>>> market traders do not attempt to create, control or make trends.
>>> They simply identify & ride them, while seeking wealth. <<
>>>
>>> Waiting and seeking are still forms of controlling.
>>>
>> Yes, they are forms of governing one self. Actually, this is a very
>> narrow and focused form of control: control of one's self. We often
>> refer to this as 'discipline', which is distinct from the more
>> general word 'control'. Self-discipline vs. attempted control of
>> others, if you will.
>>
>>> Your loving man has chosen to wait for his goal rather than (to
>>> coin a phrase) being prepared to be surprised by another woman.
>>>
>> The man in the hypothetical situation has a current goal, which is
>> to be in relationship with a certain woman. He watches and follows
>> the trend of her interest. This does not mean he is blind to what
>> the wider environment might be offering now.
>>
>>> He may not be trying to control her, but he’s still trying to
>>> control the situation in a way that he thinks will allow him to
>>> achieve his goal.
>>>
>> It sounds like 'the situation' you mention above is: "him or her
>> self." That's discipline of self, not control of others.
>>
>>>
>>> Those who seek wealth do likewise: they don’t randomly ride the
>>> trends, they identify them and make choices about how to ride
>>> them, in order to obtain wealth. That is control.
>>>
>> Um, if you mean control of one's responses, if you mean
>> self-goverance, self-discipline then yes. Controlling one self is
>> generally a good idea, is it not?
>>
>>>
>>> I don’t think it’s possible to be goal-oriented and try to exert
>>> some kind of control over the process, unless your goal is… to
>>> have no goal.
>>>
>> I think you mean
>> "...I don’t think it’s possible to be goal-oriented and NOT try to
>> exert some kind of control over the process.."
>>
>> If that's the case, I agree 100% goal-oriented requires
>> self-control, aka "discipline". Trend-trading markets traders
>> without discipline routinely lose money. Individuals without
>> self-control routinely create problems for themselves.
>>
>>> Actually, even being prepared to be surprised is a goal. A sort of
>>> wonderfully ridiculous one.
>>>
>> Yes, and the statement itself is: directive. Wait, whats that doing
>> in OST?
>>
>>>
>>> Jen x
>>>
>>> *Jenifer Toksvig
>>> *www.acompletelossforwords.com <http://www.**
>>> acompletelossforwords.com <http://www.acompletelossforwords.com>>
>>>
>>> *The Copenhagen Interpretation
>>> *www.**thecopenhageninterpretation.**co.uk<http://www.thecopenhageninterpretation.co.uk>
>>> <http://www.**thecopenhageninterpretation.**co.uk<http://www.thecopenhageninterpretation.co.uk>
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>
>> --
>>
>> Daniel Mezick, President
>>
>> New Technology Solutions Inc.
>>
>> (203) 915 7248 <tel:%28203%29%20915%207248> (cell)
>>
>> Bio <http://newtechusa.net/dan-**mezick/<http://newtechusa.net/dan-mezick/>>.
>> Blog
>> <http://newtechusa.net/blog/>. Twitter
>> <http://twitter.com/#%21/**danmezick/<http://twitter.com/#%21/danmezick/>
>> >.
>>
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>>
>> --
>>
>> Adriana Díaz-Berrio Ph.D. CRHA
>> (514) 739 2268
>> www.diazberrio.com <http://www.diazberrio.com>
>>
>>
>>
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> --
> Michael M Pannwitz
> Draisweg 1, 12209 Berlin, Germany
> ++49 - 30-772 8000
>
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Adriana Díaz-Berrio Ph.D. CRHA
(514) 739 2268
www.diazberrio.com
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