[OSList] The five principles in Welsh?

[Jon Harvey]

Hi Lisa

 

I know what you mean – even before the advent of online translation I
remember a school friend of mine seeking a French translation of ‘I love
you’ – and he came up with ‘Je zéro toi’ overlooking that he had taken the
‘love’ from a tennis meaning


 

I do think that linguistically, Welsh is perhaps a more straightforward
language than Spanish and less subject to colloquial transformations – due
to the fact that Spanish is spoken by many more people. On this basis, I
think it is more likely that Google translate would have come up with a
reasonable pro-tem solution – given that Kirsty’s workshop is just 4 days
away! 

 

But naturally, if Kirsty can find a Welsh speaker who can grasp the vibrancy
of the 5 guidelines etc in time – that would be far more preferable option.
I would ask my Welsh speaking Mum but other factors mean that would not work
at present.

 

But good luck Kirsty!

 

Atb

 

Jon

 

From: oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org
[mailto:oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org] On Behalf Of Lisa Heft
Sent: 10 July 2012 06:40
To: World wide Open Space Technology email list
Subject: Re: [OSList] The five principles in Welsh?

 

Hi, Jon, Kirsty and others - 

 

My experience with the online translation software - for example in Spanish
- is that I have to go in there (if I am using something like Google
Translate) to select / correct / substitute words that may in fact be
choices for literal translations of words but are not correct or fluid for
communication.

 

For example I had a hilarious translation that translated something I was
saying about the fact that I was going to fly into an airport (in an
airplane) with the word 'fly' (the insect).

 

I have also have the experience of - even with someone who is fluent in a
language - if they do not have the depth and breadth of an expansive
vocabulary, they do not have the words to capture the nuance and meaning of
everything they are translating. They translate something literally. Which
does not translate something culturally or regionally.

 

So when I have looked for translations - I have sought out someone who is
very expressive and nuanced in their own home language - and we sit together
and talk about what these principles and law phrases really truly mean, in
the context of Open Space. And in the course of the conversation not only
are they asking and offering things that we can explore and clarify together
for the best choice of words - but they also become a passionate ambassador
for the Open Space event itself. And together we learn so much about
culture, context and communication.

 

I always say this - and in fact I have had this experience: If you cannot
find a professional translator or a person with an extensive vocabulary in
their home language (and ability to understand yours for that conversation)
- find.... a poet. Because their job is to swim around in language and
select words - not always the obvious words - for rich and complex
meaning-making.

 

Friends - what are your other experiences, especially if different than
mine?

 

Lisa

 

 

On Jul 9, 2012, at 5:35 AM, Jon Harvey wrote:





Hi Kisty

 

Google translate says:

 

Pwy bynnag ddaw yn y bobl iawn

Beth bynnag fydd yn digwydd yw'r unig beth a allai gael

Lle bynnag y mae'n digwydd yn y lle iawn

Pryd bynnag y bydd yn dechrau yn yr adeg iawn

Pan mae'n dros mae'n dros

 

Mae cyfraith dwy droedfedd / gyfraith symudedd

Byddwch yn barod i gael ei synnu

 

Given that Welsh is a pretty formulaic language (unlike English) – there is
a good chance this translation is reasonable.

 

Hope this helps

 

atb

 

Jon

 

From: oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org
[mailto:oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org] On Behalf Of Kirsty Lothian
Sent: 05 July 2012 16:38
To: oslist at lists.openspacetech.org
Subject: [OSList] The five principles in Welsh?

 

Hello OS List,

 

I think this is actually my first post, although I have been reading for few
years now! I am working with Improbable and Phelim McDermott on the Devoted
and Disgruntled open space Roadshow which we are on this summer. On Saturday
we will be doing our very first OS bilingual in Welsh and English. So...
Does anyone know the principles and laws in Welsh?

 

We are after the full complement:

 

Whoever comes are the right people

Whatever happens is the only thing that could have

Wherever it happens is the right place

Whenever it starts is the right time

When it's over it's over

 

The law of two feet/ law of mobility

Be prepared to be surprised

 

Many thanks for any help you can offer,

Thanks,

 

Kirsty

 

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