"learning" OS and more; was use of OS in a training for trainers

[Julie Stuart]

Raffi,

Sorry, I think I tied myself up in knots in my last mail.

I have found in my work that some people focus on "being trained" in order
to feel that they can facilitate a (any) process, and want to be sure that
they have got the "right" training from the "right" people in the "right"
format.  I can see the argument for this with some tools and techniques,
although I have heard of people facilitating future search (for example)
without any training at all, simply using the book and applying the
principles.

With open space however, I don't know that it is the training (or lack of
it) that makes the difference.  The real key it seems to me is to actually
trust the process and the people, rather than just saying that you do.  I
can't see that any amount of training, even with the best, can guarantee
that someone will get it.  I know people who have been trained in open
space, who have used it at times with groups, who understand it completely
intellectually and think it's a fantastic thing - but when it comes to
actually opening space with a group they feel utterly out of control as
facilitators and set rules and give instructions and essentially close the
space right back down again.  No matter how often they see it work they
still can't believe that the group will self-organise without their help
(the market place seems to cause particular panic), or that a self-selected
group of 20 people will be able to have a meaningful discussion (given the
facilitator wisdom that self-managing discussion groups shuoldn't be larger
than 8 or certainly 10 people).

I hope that this is a little clearer?  I'm winding down for a couple of
weeks on holiday, and my brain seems to be slightly muddled this week.

I went to a Quaker school but I am not actually a Quaker myself.  When I
moved to secondary (high) school there was a choice of several local schools
for me.  One of these was very competitive and the other was more supportive
of individuals and had an ethos of helping every pupil achieve the best that
they could do, in compeition only with themselves.  I felt at that stage
that there really was only one choice for me.  It has to be said, that at
that time the school was (and sitill) is a part of the state education
system, and there were very few Quakers attending, but the Head was always a
Quaker, and I feel that something of the values percolated down into
everyone who went there to some extent.

All the best,
Julie


>From: Raffi Aftandelian <raffi at pochtamt.ru>
>Reply-To: OSLIST <OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU>
>To: OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU
>Subject: [OSLIST] "learning" OS and more; was use of OS in a training for
>trainers
>Date: Tue, 6 Jul 2004 11:08:35 +0400
>
>Hi Julie!
>Thanks for your response! I didn't quite get what you meant here:
>
>"what I really wanted to
>say was that learning or remembering open space doesn't seem to me to be
>directly related to what training a facilitator has or has not received,
>and
>that focusing on the training aspect might not be the most helpful thing to
>do.  I think that it is more closely linked to your experience and
>approach,
>and to whether you as a facilitator can actually believe what you say to
>participants - that they really can self manage and come up with something
>great on their own."
>
>There was an important thought or several thoughts in this paragraph; but I
>am not exactly sure what you meant.
>
>You say you went to a Quaker school, but you don't say you are a Quaker. I
>came to Quakerism in Russia, but for a variety of reasons do not practice
>it (in the sense of going to Meeting for Worship). One of the things I have
>wondered about is why Quakers (maybe the Quakers on this list will reply!)
>don't use OS regularly in the life of the Meeting, as another tool for
>conducting Meeting for Worship for Business. While I think discerning the
>spirit of the group and using consensus is very powerful, conscious use of
>OS is also about Spirit. I sometimes find meeting for worship for business,
>well, boring frankly. Maybe that's a reflection of much innerwork that I
>need to do, to truly understand how passion reflects itself in this type of
>meeting.
>
>
>Raffi Aftandelian
>
>
>Date:    Mon, 5 Jul 2004 08:46:15 +0000
>From:    Julie Stuart <juliesstuart at hotmail.com>
>Subject: Re: use of OS in a training for trainers
>
>Raffi,
>
>I think that it's wonderful that you felt able to conduct part of a
>training
>session in open space despite some misgivings.  I just wanted to reply to
>the last part of your mail, about "learning" to facilitate open space.
>
>>From my experience in facilitating various types of off-the-shelf
>participative processes (as well as hybrids that we develop to suit a
>particular purpose), open space is not necessarily something that you need
>to be formally trained to use.  I have several colleagues who have been to
>learning workshops on open space, and yet of everyone in the organisation
>it
>is me who invariably takes the baton and runs with it when an opportunity
>arises to open space with a client.  I think that this is because open
>space
>is something that resonates with me personally and I especially enjoy the
>challenge to my normal ways of control that it offers me.  On the other
>hand, my colleagues find it very difficult to let go and trust in the
>process and the people to self-manage, and they know themselves that while
>they get it in theory they just don't quite believe in it.  I have never
>had
>any formal training in open space - I just go with what I've learnt from
>the
>books, from OSonOs in Swenmark last year, and from the wisdom I've gathered
>from lurking on this list for the past couple of years.  I have had lots of
>training in general facilitation skills and in other processes so perhaps
>this gave me the confidence to jump into open space more quickly than
>otherwise.
>
>So, in case I've missed my point and rambled off, what I really wanted to
>say was that learning or remembering open space doesn't seem to me to be
>directly related to what training a facilitator has or has not received,
>and
>that focusing on the training aspect might not be the most helpful thing to
>do.  I think that it is more closely linked to your experience and
>approach,
>and to whether you as a facilitator can actually believe what you say to
>participants - that they really can self manage and come up with something
>great on their own.
>
>I'd also like to thank you for the links to AVP information.  Although I
>grew up and live in Northern Ireland and went to a Quaker school, I had
>never heard of the project before.  Good luck with all your work,
>
>Julie Stuart
>
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