AW: Central Asia

[Doersam, Laurel]

Hmmmm.  Interesting.  By using the term personal, I wasn't meaning to infer
that the experience couldn't be in a group.  It actually didn't occur to me
that some folks might think that all valid spiritual experience would be
solo.  Many of my most profound spiritual experiences have been in
community, for this is when I've most clearly felt my connection to the
oneness.

It struck me as ironic there might be a distrust of group in spiritual
circles (for doesn't a circle infer group-ness?).
 Our experiences on this planet are entirely human . . . we have no other
filter by which to interpret our reality. . . and we are such social beings
. . . I agree that missing this connection, this experience of group-ness,
this synergy, would be a terrible loss.  (And yet, I also don't want to
diminish the value of alone-ness for both personal, spiritual and
relationship growth.)

Thanks, Kenoli, for inspiring more thought for me.

And, thanks, Meg, for tying it back to Wilbur's four quadrants - that made
sense to me.  Hmmm, the shadow side - that opens up another can o' worms.
Presuming that groups/communities also have shadow sides (which I've
certainly experienced, so I think they do), then maybe it is the lurking
shadow that causes distrust of the group experience?

Laurel.
-----Original Message-----
From: kenoli Oleari [mailto:kenoli at IGC.ORG]
Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2001 12:49 PM
To: OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU
Subject: Re: AW: Central Asia


Laurel --

This interests me.  I think there are two important elements here: 1)
being connected with our own experience -- which is how I think we
tune into the oneness that we are all part of -- and 2) recognizing
(or realizing) our connection with each other and celebrating that --
a kind of human realization of that oneness.  I think we have to do
our own work to accomplish the first and to fully enter into the
second.  I also think that certain qualities of group experience can
enhance personal and spiritual growth.  There is not a linear
relationship here.

I have always been concerned with what I see as an unnecessary and
frustrating division between people with a basically "spiritual"
orientation and people with a community or "group" orientation.
Wilbur has talked a lot about the distinctions that arise out of a
Spiral Dynamic interpretation of various states of development.  I am
concerned sometimes that some of his work, especially focus on the
"mean green" furthers this distinction.  Group connections and
process have been a critical part of my personal and spiritual
development, along with my person work.  I sense a distrust of
"group" in many spiritual circles. If feels like an important element
of human experience is lost when this is missed.

I think "group" can be a spiritual experience.

Kenoli

>Julie wrote:
>
>"I think we experience truth when we recognize our connection with each
>other, and become glad.  Perhaps healing is what happens in the wake of
>recognizing the truth of our connection with each other.  Maybe that is the
>only truth that matters."
>
>
>Thanks, Julie, for jumping in.  Your comment grabbed me by the heart and
>guts  - and, if it is "true", then in fact, there is only one truth which
>encompasses the ALL in which we participate.  And that truth, that all is
>one, can't be known or understood through the intellect, but only through
>personal mystical or intuitive experience.  (Here I go with the Ken
>Wilburisms ...) This seems to tie in with the Gaia consciousness discussion
>that has been a parallel thread over the last week or two - Harrison and
>Typhoid Mary notwithstanding!!
>
>Great conversation!  Thanks, all (and thanks, ALL)
>
>Laurel.
>
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--
Kenoli Oleari, Horizons of Change, http://www.horizonsofchange.com
1801 Fairview Street, Berkeley, CA  94703   Voice Phone: 510-601-8217,
Fax: 510-595-8369, Email: kenoli at igc.org (or click on:
mailto://kenoli@igc.org)

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