[OSList] Brett Wood Podcast

Sun May 21 01:26:49 PDT 2017

Dear HO,

is there an answer to your question at the end of your note below
"What is this justification for this travesty?"

Do we want to know? Are we willing to face it?

Neither do I have THE answer nor am I sure that there is THE answer.

Gunnar Hjelholt, the fellow who founded social psychology in Denmark, 
spent time in a forced labor camp in Germany as a young man toward the 
end of WWII. Reflections on that experience were published many years 
later in: "Survival in the Organization".

Two quotes (page 84..):

"Where do Systems Come From?
In the Jewish narrative of creation, the creation of man is mentioned 
twice. The first time it is said that God created us equal to all other 
creation, that is, like nature: Everything which has to do with simple 
survival. The second time it is added that Bod created us in his image, 
that is, as spirit. People are nature and spirit and the two elements 
either struggle with each other or work together.
Once mankind had been made in this way, it then created the organization 
  -  in its image.
The wording "in its image", means that we can not create something that 
does not have its roots in ourselves; and it appears as if what we do, 
over and over again, is related to simple survival -  to "nature" rather 
than "spirit".
The organization of the concentration camp (forced labor camp) was not 
significantly different from that of other systems we have developed 
over time. The stay in Porta (the forced labor camp) may have made it 
easier for me to understand how people carry that organization within 
them, in all kinds of work-related settings."

further on he writes:

"The theme that I keep coming back to has to do with the system versus 
the individual. The oppressive hierarchy. Is it really necessary? And I 
am still astonished that there is room for humanity there, under those 
circumstances."

and later he adds (under the heading: "The Concentration Camp as an 
Organizational Prototype"):

"If you choose instead to become a part of the system, you risk becoming 
a supporter, a Kapo. The Kapos were preoccupied with their own survival, 
above all else. That is what Vincent Lind calls dealing with the Devil."

Here the interviewers interrupt by asking:

"There we have the Devil again. What would a system look like if God had 
created it?"
Gunnars remark to this question:
"I have been trying to figure that out ever since. However we will have 
to save that for another time."

This is the last senctence of this book.

So, to me, the "justification" you asked for, or the "reason", I would 
ask, seems to be fairly clear in the context of what Gunnar has to 
say... it has to do with the prevalence of the nature part of us that 
creates oppressive systems.

The mystery remains, what would a system look like if God had created it?

Has he created selforganization? Are we not extremely successfull 
fencing in and controlling selforganization in the sense we talk about 
it in the context of OST? Is selforganization closer to the spirit part 
of us?

Greetings from Berlin
mmp

---

Am 03.05.2017 um 01:11 schrieb Harrison Owen via OSList:
> Nicely done! And Michael – you might remind your bother that what he
> described is not unique. It always happens. It is a rare closing circle
> where tears are not shed. And after 30+ years of sitting “there,” I am
> never surprised. Now the question is: Why not every day? As I asked the
> Director of a Large US government agency who described his employees as
> “totally non-functional” before opening some space. Then we sat in a
> circle…. And  folks were definitely alive, creative, and engaged. And my
> question was: “What is it that you are doing as a business practice
> which renders these obviously engaged, creative, lively folks to be
> total Zombies?” He took a deep breath and didn’t say a word. So the
> question remains… What is this justification for this travesty?
>
>
>
> Harrison
>
>
>
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> *From:*OSList [mailto:oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org] *On Behalf
> Of *Koos de Heer via OSList
> *Sent:* Tuesday, May 2, 2017 3:25 PM
> *To:* 'Michael Wood'; 'World wide Open Space Technology email list'
> *Subject:* Re: [OSList] Brett Wood Podcast
>
>
>
> Great testimony indeed Michael. Thanks for sharing!
>
>
>
> Koos
>
>
>
> *Van:*OSList [mailto:oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org] *Namens
> *Michael Wood via OSList
> *Verzonden:* dinsdag 2 mei 2017 06:20
> *Aan:* oslist at lists.openspacetech.org
> <mailto:oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> *Onderwerp:* [OSList] Brett Wood Podcast
>
>
>
> Lovely testimony here to the power of OST, in the context of creativity.
>  Brett Wood is my brother and he is based in Sydney.
>
>
>
> The section of the podcast specifically related to OST is at 56 minutes
> and 30 seconds through to 1 hour and 8 seconds. You can fast forward to
> that point if you want to.
>
>
>
> http://theredshoes.com.au/podcast-ep-6-brett-robin-wood/
>
>
>
>
>
> Michael Wood
>
> Perth, Western Australia
>
>
>
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-- 
Michael M Pannwitz
Draisweg 1, 12209 Berlin, Germany
++49 - 30-772 8000
mmpannwitz at gmail.com

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