[OSList] Accessibility concerns about bending down to pick up paper/pens
Sarah Grange via OSList
oslist at lists.openspacetech.org
Wed Aug 24 02:35:01 PDT 2016
We often have people for whom knees/backs make bending down difficult. We solve this very simply by providing A3 clipboards in the centre, and making the offer that anyone for whom getting to the middle is an issue should find a way to communicate this to us and we can bring a clipboard, or ask a neighbour to assist. The large clipboards also make it easier for people who use wheelchairs as they can place the board across armrests and create a stable surface.
Sarah
Sarah Grange
Open Space Producer
sarah at improbable.co.uk
www.devotedanddisgruntled.com <http://www.devotedanddisgruntled.com/>
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020 7240 4556
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>
> Message: 5
> Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2016 22:27:50 -0600
> From: Harold Shinsato via OSList <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> To: OSLIST <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> Subject: [OSList] Accessibility concerns about bending down to pick up
> paper/pens
> Message-ID: <79fa0da2-b640-4cf1-c50c-923f93b8eb0a at shinsato.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed"
>
> In the many OST's I've participated in or helped open myself, I've
> encountered this complaint about having to bend over to pick up the pens
> and the papers in only two instances. Both of which were Universities.
> In both cases, the leading edge of the complaint seemed to have to do
> with women's dresses, but I also heard something about being "able"
> prejudiced.
>
> The first University chose to put some tables outside the circle with
> some papers and markers. The second one is thinking they will wheel in a
> table after the opening into the center, which seems energetically
> disruptive.
>
> Have others encountered this? How did you deal with it?
>
> Thanks!
> Harold
>
> --
> Harold Shinsato
> harold at shinsato.com <mailto:harold at shinsato.com>
> http://shinsato.com
> twitter: @hajush <http://twitter.com/hajush>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2016 21:35:19 -0700
> From: Lisa Heft - via OSList <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> To: Harold Shinsato <harold at shinsato.com>, OSLIST
> <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> Subject: Re: [OSList] Accessibility concerns about bending down to
> pick up paper/pens
> Message-ID: <CD45B3B2-F3B0-4B86-8A89-BFC130DF88FB at openingspace.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Hi, Harold.
>
> ?For anyone whose body does not work like this, I (my assistant) will be walking around the (outside of the) circle with paper and markers.?
>
> I say this every time. It?s standard, as I try to practice inclusivity by practicing inclusive language. I only set up sign-making tables after a discussion with the client shows quite a number of participants are unable to move comfortably. This has only happened once, when working with farmers / farmworkers who have serious pain / arthritis resulting from working decades with toxic pesticides. In all other instances, my walking around the outside of the circle with paper and markers allows individuals to self-select for any private reason, whether it is because of a short skirt or mobility reasons or any reason at all.
>
> Lisa
>
> Lisa Heft
> Consultant, Facilitator, Educator
> Opening Space
>
>> On Aug 18, 2016, at 9:27 PM, Harold Shinsato via OSList <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org> wrote:
>>
>> In the many OST's I've participated in or helped open myself, I've encountered this complaint about having to bend over to pick up the pens and the papers in only two instances. Both of which were Universities. In both cases, the leading edge of the complaint seemed to have to do with women's dresses, but I also heard something about being "able" prejudiced.
>>
>> The first University chose to put some tables outside the circle with some papers and markers. The second one is thinking they will wheel in a table after the opening into the center, which seems energetically disruptive.
>>
>> Have others encountered this? How did you deal with it?
>>
>> Thanks!
>> Harold
>>
>> --
>> Harold Shinsato
>> harold at shinsato.com <mailto:harold at shinsato.com>
>> http://shinsato.com <http://shinsato.com/>
>> twitter: @hajush <http://twitter.com/hajush>
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2016 22:32:41 -0700
> From: Christine Whitney Sanchez via OSList
> <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> To: Harold Shinsato <harold at shinsato.com>, World wide Open Space
> Technology email list <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> Subject: Re: [OSList] Accessibility concerns about bending down to
> pick up paper/pens
> Message-ID:
> <D9DC86CE-BA69-42E8-BC38-676C6A250AFF at innovationpartners.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> I once opened the space for a municipal gathering that was focused on preventing elder abuse, co-sponsored by a police department and the Area Agency on Aging. They did a wonderful job of inviting elders from the community and offering transportation and other supports to help them to get to the conference center.
>
> The design team decided to offer foamboards to the elders, who could ask a neighbor to retrieve a pen and paper from the center so that the elder could write her or his own topic without having to struggle into the middle of the circle. Some of the elders asked that same neighbor to post their topic on the wall. But they all got the mic and announced their topic themselves.
>
> There were so many wonderful moments in this event, one of which was the way the participants, without any prompting from me, collectively made sure that it was very quiet when the elders announced their topics, which eventually extended to all of the topic announcements, creating a sacred tone for the gathering.
>
> Thanks for the inquiry, dear Harold.
> Namast?,
>
> Christine
>
> Christine Whitney Sanchez, M.C.
> Phoenix, AZ, USA ? +1.480.759.0262
> www.claremontlincoln.edu
> www.innovationpartners.com
> www.christinewhitneysanchez.com
> Facebook <https://www.facebook.com/ChristineWhitneySanchez> | LinkedIn <https://www.linkedin.com/in/christinewhitneysanchez?authType=NAME_SEARCH&authToken=Zy8g&locale=en_US&trk=tyah&trkInfo=clickedVertical:mynetwork,clickedEntityId:16048,authType:NAME_SEARCH,idx:1-1-1,tarId:1463366987763,tas:Ch> | Twitter <https://twitter.com/CWhitneySanchez>
>
>
>
> On Aug 18, 2016, at 9:27 PM, Harold Shinsato via OSList <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org> wrote:
>
> In the many OST's I've participated in or helped open myself, I've encountered this complaint about having to bend over to pick up the pens and the papers in only two instances. Both of which were Universities. In both cases, the leading edge of the complaint seemed to have to do with women's dresses, but I also heard something about being "able" prejudiced.
>
> The first University chose to put some tables outside the circle with some papers and markers. The second one is thinking they will wheel in a table after the opening into the center, which seems energetically disruptive.
>
> Have others encountered this? How did you deal with it?
>
> Thanks!
> Harold
>
> --
> Harold Shinsato
> harold at shinsato.com <mailto:harold at shinsato.com>
> http://shinsato.com <http://shinsato.com/>
> twitter: @hajush <http://twitter.com/hajush>_______________________________________________
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 08:43:53 +0300
> From: Bhavesh Patel via OSList <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> To: Harold Shinsato <harold at shinsato.com>, World wide Open Space
> Technology email list <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> Subject: Re: [OSList] Accessibility concerns about bending down to
> pick up paper/pens
> Message-ID:
> <CAAho442aR_0ki=rsx_fMWkZ6n40_2Lyft-=vuFrDwHF9VEaZVQ at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Maybe they solved it themselves?
>
> A few pillows for knees in the middle?
>
> A few trays to lean on to write?
>
>
>
> On 19 August 2016 at 07:27, Harold Shinsato via OSList <
> oslist at lists.openspacetech.org> wrote:
>
>> In the many OST's I've participated in or helped open myself, I've
>> encountered this complaint about having to bend over to pick up the pens
>> and the papers in only two instances. Both of which were Universities. In
>> both cases, the leading edge of the complaint seemed to have to do with
>> women's dresses, but I also heard something about being "able" prejudiced.
>>
>> The first University chose to put some tables outside the circle with some
>> papers and markers. The second one is thinking they will wheel in a table
>> after the opening into the center, which seems energetically disruptive.
>>
>> Have others encountered this? How did you deal with it?
>>
>> Thanks!
>> Harold
>>
>> --
>> Harold Shinsato
>> harold at shinsato.com
>> http://shinsato.com
>> twitter: @hajush <http://twitter.com/hajush>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> OSList mailing list
>> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
>> To unsubscribe send an email to OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>> Past archives can be viewed here: http://www.mail-archive.com/
>> oslist at lists.openspacetech.org
>>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 07:47:17 -0400
> From: Harrison Owen via OSList <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> To: "'Harold Shinsato'" <harold at shinsato.com>, "'World wide Open Space
> Technology email list'" <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> Subject: Re: [OSList] Accessibility concerns about bending down to
> pick up paper/pens
> Message-ID: <002a01d1fa0f$7044b720$50ce2560$@net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Harold ? I have encountered the problem rarely ? and almost inevitably at a University or very senior corporate setting. It set me to thinking? that the issue was largely a matter of ego and not physical disability. Especially when I noticed that those who were actually physically disabled quickly found a work around ? well before I could do anything. After all it was a world they lived in and negotiated every day. In most cases they just asked for help. But I did find myself using words of invitation when it came time to write their issues: ?Grab a piece of paper and write your issue shortly. If your ego and arthritis permit, just get down on the floor. If you need some help, ask for it.? Works every time.
>
>
>
> ho
>
>
>
> Winter Address
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>
> From: OSList [mailto:oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org] On Behalf Of Harold Shinsato via OSList
> Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 12:28 AM
> To: OSLIST
> Subject: [OSList] Accessibility concerns about bending down to pick up paper/pens
>
>
>
> In the many OST's I've participated in or helped open myself, I've encountered this complaint about having to bend over to pick up the pens and the papers in only two instances. Both of which were Universities. In both cases, the leading edge of the complaint seemed to have to do with women's dresses, but I also heard something about being "able" prejudiced.
>
> The first University chose to put some tables outside the circle with some papers and markers. The second one is thinking they will wheel in a table after the opening into the center, which seems energetically disruptive.
>
> Have others encountered this? How did you deal with it?
>
> Thanks!
> Harold
>
> --
> Harold Shinsato
> harold at shinsato.com
> http://shinsato.com
> twitter: @hajush <http://twitter.com/hajush>
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 10
> Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 08:13:20 -0400
> From: Jennifer Hurley via OSList <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> To: World wide Open Space Technology email list
> <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> Subject: Re: [OSList] Accessibility concerns about bending down to
> pick up paper/pens
> Message-ID: <9D759993-5C88-4895-9EBF-87FD3541B331 at hfadesign.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> I often say something in the opening like "if it's difficult for you to bend over or you think your handwriting is too bad, ask one of your neighbors to help." This also gives an easy out to anyone who may be illiterate. I think it also fosters a sense of camaraderie. But it doesn't make it 100% as easy for someone with physical or literacy problems to participate, so it may not be the best answer. I really resist tables inside the circle, though. I've had to do several events that way, and there is definitely a negative impact on the energy in the room.
>
> Jennifer Hurley
> Hurley-Franks & Associates
> 267-971-4598
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Aug 19, 2016, at 12:27 AM, Harold Shinsato via OSList <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org> wrote:
>>
>> In the many OST's I've participated in or helped open myself, I've encountered this complaint about having to bend over to pick up the pens and the papers in only two instances. Both of which were Universities. In both cases, the leading edge of the complaint seemed to have to do with women's dresses, but I also heard something about being "able" prejudiced.
>>
>> The first University chose to put some tables outside the circle with some papers and markers. The second one is thinking they will wheel in a table after the opening into the center, which seems energetically disruptive.
>>
>> Have others encountered this? How did you deal with it?
>>
>> Thanks!
>> Harold
>>
>> --
>> Harold Shinsato
>> harold at shinsato.com
>> http://shinsato.com
>> twitter: @hajush
>> _______________________________________________
>> OSList mailing list
>> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
>> To unsubscribe send an email to OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>> Past archives can be viewed here: http://www.mail-archive.com/oslist@lists.openspacetech.org
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 11
> Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 06:28:23 -0700
> From: MK Vidrine via OSList <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> To: World wide Open Space Technology email list
> <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> Subject: Re: [OSList] Accessibility concerns about bending down to
> pick up paper/pens
> Message-ID:
> <CAHMOz8ZAj9Kktz6GEHXAcGmFkQjTkR-neZ+zK8NbvMfJ7DDDUA at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> I wonder if there would be any difference in results between inviting
> people to ask their neighbors to help, and inviting people to offer help to
> their neighbors? I'm imagining something like, "When you grab a piece of
> paper, you could also get one for someone else nearby. After you write down
> what you've got in mind, see if you can write down a thought for a neighbor
> also- let's get as many written as we can."
>
> -MK
>
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 5:13 AM, Jennifer Hurley via OSList <
> oslist at lists.openspacetech.org> wrote:
>
>> I often say something in the opening like "if it's difficult for you to
>> bend over or you think your handwriting is too bad, ask one of your
>> neighbors to help." This also gives an easy out to anyone who may be
>> illiterate. I think it also fosters a sense of camaraderie. But it doesn't
>> make it 100% as easy for someone with physical or literacy problems to
>> participate, so it may not be the best answer. I really resist tables
>> inside the circle, though. I've had to do several events that way, and
>> there is definitely a negative impact on the energy in the room.
>>
>> Jennifer Hurley
>> Hurley-Franks & Associates
>> 267-971-4598
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Aug 19, 2016, at 12:27 AM, Harold Shinsato via OSList <
>> oslist at lists.openspacetech.org> wrote:
>>
>> In the many OST's I've participated in or helped open myself, I've
>> encountered this complaint about having to bend over to pick up the pens
>> and the papers in only two instances. Both of which were Universities. In
>> both cases, the leading edge of the complaint seemed to have to do with
>> women's dresses, but I also heard something about being "able" prejudiced.
>>
>> The first University chose to put some tables outside the circle with some
>> papers and markers. The second one is thinking they will wheel in a table
>> after the opening into the center, which seems energetically disruptive.
>>
>> Have others encountered this? How did you deal with it?
>>
>> Thanks!
>> Harold
>>
>> --
>> Harold Shinsato
>> harold at shinsato.com
>> http://shinsato.com
>> twitter: @hajush <http://twitter.com/hajush>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> OSList mailing list
>> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
>> To unsubscribe send an email to OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>> Past archives can be viewed here: http://www.mail-archive.com/
>> oslist at lists.openspacetech.org
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> OSList mailing list
>> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
>> To unsubscribe send an email to OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
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>>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 12
> Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 16:10:49 +0200
> From: Michael M Pannwitz via OSList <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> To: MK Vidrine <m.k.vidrine at gmail.com>, World wide Open Space
> Technology email list <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> Subject: Re: [OSList] Accessibility concerns about bending down to
> pick up paper/pens
> Message-ID: <62a31a8a-d225-d592-5aab-cd17843c7206 at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
>
> I have seen people reject such help from others, especially with
> considerable verve from folks that one might consider differentially
> abled. One thing I have never seen is someone writing a thought for
> someone else.
> What happens regularly with younger children is that they will huddle
> and discuss an issue that they want to put on the paper.
>
> Considering the attempt to expand time and space for the force of
> selforganistion to show up in an OST event more clearly accompanied with
> some manifestation of selforganisation being the mode for participants I
> wonder what the least controlling, least prescreptive... mode might be
> for facilitation.
>
> Regarding the offering of issues I tell people very shortly after I have
> started my introduciton what I will invite them to later on... and I
> actually go through all the steps (walking to the center, getting on the
> floor, jotting down an issue, announcing it to the group, walking up to
> the bulletin board and posting it)... and then continue with my
> introduction. At the point of inviting for issues I have reduced my
> words to almost zero but I do make an inviting gesture towards the center...
>
> Greetings from Berlin
> mmp
>
> On 19.08.2016 15:28, MK Vidrine via OSList wrote:
>> I wonder if there would be any difference in results between inviting
>> people to ask their neighbors to help, and inviting people to offer help
>> to their neighbors? I'm imagining something like, "When you grab a piece
>> of paper, you could also get one for someone else nearby. After you
>> write down what you've got in mind, see if you can write down a thought
>> for a neighbor also- let's get as many written as we can."
>>
>> -MK
>>
>> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 5:13 AM, Jennifer Hurley via OSList
>> <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org <mailto:oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>>
>> wrote:
>>
>> I often say something in the opening like "if it's difficult for you
>> to bend over or you think your handwriting is too bad, ask one of
>> your neighbors to help." This also gives an easy out to anyone who
>> may be illiterate. I think it also fosters a sense of camaraderie.
>> But it doesn't make it 100% as easy for someone with physical or
>> literacy problems to participate, so it may not be the best answer.
>> I really resist tables inside the circle, though. I've had to do
>> several events that way, and there is definitely a negative impact
>> on the energy in the room.
>>
>> Jennifer Hurley
>> Hurley-Franks & Associates
>> 267-971-4598 <tel:267-971-4598>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Aug 19, 2016, at 12:27 AM, Harold Shinsato via OSList
>> <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org
>> <mailto:oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>> wrote:
>>
>>> In the many OST's I've participated in or helped open myself, I've
>>> encountered this complaint about having to bend over to pick up
>>> the pens and the papers in only two instances. Both of which were
>>> Universities. In both cases, the leading edge of the complaint
>>> seemed to have to do with women's dresses, but I also heard
>>> something about being "able" prejudiced.
>>>
>>> The first University chose to put some tables outside the circle
>>> with some papers and markers. The second one is thinking they will
>>> wheel in a table after the opening into the center, which seems
>>> energetically disruptive.
>>>
>>> Have others encountered this? How did you deal with it?
>>>
>>> Thanks!
>>> Harold
>>>
>>> --
>>> Harold Shinsato
>>> harold at shinsato.com <mailto:harold at shinsato.com>
>>> http://shinsato.com
>>> twitter: @hajush <http://twitter.com/hajush>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> OSList mailing list
>>> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
>>> <mailto:OSList at lists.openspacetech.org>
>>> To unsubscribe send an email to
>>> OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
>>> <mailto:OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org>
>>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
>>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>>> <http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org>
>>> Past archives can be viewed here:
>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/oslist@lists.openspacetech.org
>>> <http://www.mail-archive.com/oslist@lists.openspacetech.org>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> OSList mailing list
>> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
>> <mailto:OSList at lists.openspacetech.org>
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>> <mailto:oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> OSList mailing list
>> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
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>> Past archives can be viewed here: http://www.mail-archive.com/oslist@lists.openspacetech.org
>>
>
> --
> Michael M Pannwitz
> Draisweg 1, 12209 Berlin, Germany
> ++49 - 30-772 8000
>
>
>
> Check out the Open Space World Map presently showing 414 resident Open
> Space Workers in 68 countries working in a total of 144 countries
> worldwide: www.openspaceworldmap.org
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 13
> Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 14:38:14 +0000
> From: Birgitt Williams via OSList <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> To: World wide Open Space Technology email list
> <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> Subject: Re: [OSList] Accessibility concerns about bending down to
> pick up paper/pens
> Message-ID:
> <CAKF340hWDq=ChYgTG4Z9ReLQBZEOW=MvuajpYz052LJiggpLjw at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Hi all,
> I am choosing to answer a question that was not asked. The question is
> 'what is needed in our OST meetings to ensure that people who have
> disabilities of any sort can feel welcomed and included?'. Having worked
> with people with lots of different abilities and what are commonly referred
> to as disabilities...both obvious and invisible, there are some things our
> clients have recommended. Some of them are basic good manners of welcome as
> we would include in our homes.
>
> 1. For visually impaired, do not have markers/pens rolling around on the
> floor either in the middle or at the agenda wall...use some sort of
> container and explain to people why. For the blind, having a partner to
> assist throughout the process is helpful....it is amazing how much of an
> OST meeting depends on being able to see. For the deaf, arrange for people
> to sign...not just in the main room but in the breakout space....and if
> signing is no longer the best option with our advanced technology, do
> something that is current and helpful.
> 2. For seniors and those taking medications who have difficulty seeing a
> typical printed report...have reports on flip chart paper with big print OR
> if printed on a computer, use 18 point or greater font...and double space.
> 3. For the 10% of the population who gets headaches and other symptoms from
> scents/chemicals, use unscented markers/pens and in the invitation ask
> people to refrain from wearing any products with fragrances. Check the
> venue including restrooms/toilet areas to ensure no air fresheners are in
> use. If the venue uses pesticides, arrange with them ahead of time to
> refrain from spraying on day of meeting.
> 4.For those with joints that don't bend so well, provide some kind of
> tables with markers/pens....maybe at the side...so that they can maintain
> as much independence as possible in getting the topics up.
> 5. For those who have various allergies/intolerances/cultural needs with
> food, take care with beverages and food so that people are not being left
> out by the limited usually carbohydrate choices.
>
> I am not sure if I have remembered everything and would appreciate anything
> you all have figured out to add. While I respect that we create the
> conditions for self managing, a more equal playing field from the start
> that is welcoming to all is kind...and we can do with a little more
> kindness in this world.
>
> Blessings all,
> Birgitt
>
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 10:11 AM Michael M Pannwitz via OSList <
> oslist at lists.openspacetech.org> wrote:
>
>> I have seen people reject such help from others, especially with
>> considerable verve from folks that one might consider differentially
>> abled. One thing I have never seen is someone writing a thought for
>> someone else.
>> What happens regularly with younger children is that they will huddle
>> and discuss an issue that they want to put on the paper.
>>
>> Considering the attempt to expand time and space for the force of
>> selforganistion to show up in an OST event more clearly accompanied with
>> some manifestation of selforganisation being the mode for participants I
>> wonder what the least controlling, least prescreptive... mode might be
>> for facilitation.
>>
>> Regarding the offering of issues I tell people very shortly after I have
>> started my introduciton what I will invite them to later on... and I
>> actually go through all the steps (walking to the center, getting on the
>> floor, jotting down an issue, announcing it to the group, walking up to
>> the bulletin board and posting it)... and then continue with my
>> introduction. At the point of inviting for issues I have reduced my
>> words to almost zero but I do make an inviting gesture towards the
>> center...
>>
>> Greetings from Berlin
>> mmp
>>
>> On 19.08.2016 15:28, MK Vidrine via OSList wrote:
>>> I wonder if there would be any difference in results between inviting
>>> people to ask their neighbors to help, and inviting people to offer help
>>> to their neighbors? I'm imagining something like, "When you grab a piece
>>> of paper, you could also get one for someone else nearby. After you
>>> write down what you've got in mind, see if you can write down a thought
>>> for a neighbor also- let's get as many written as we can."
>>>
>>> -MK
>>>
>>> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 5:13 AM, Jennifer Hurley via OSList
>>> <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org <mailto:oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I often say something in the opening like "if it's difficult for you
>>> to bend over or you think your handwriting is too bad, ask one of
>>> your neighbors to help." This also gives an easy out to anyone who
>>> may be illiterate. I think it also fosters a sense of camaraderie.
>>> But it doesn't make it 100% as easy for someone with physical or
>>> literacy problems to participate, so it may not be the best answer.
>>> I really resist tables inside the circle, though. I've had to do
>>> several events that way, and there is definitely a negative impact
>>> on the energy in the room.
>>>
>>> Jennifer Hurley
>>> Hurley-Franks & Associates
>>> 267-971-4598 <tel:267-971-4598>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>> On Aug 19, 2016, at 12:27 AM, Harold Shinsato via OSList
>>> <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org
>>> <mailto:oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> In the many OST's I've participated in or helped open myself, I've
>>>> encountered this complaint about having to bend over to pick up
>>>> the pens and the papers in only two instances. Both of which were
>>>> Universities. In both cases, the leading edge of the complaint
>>>> seemed to have to do with women's dresses, but I also heard
>>>> something about being "able" prejudiced.
>>>>
>>>> The first University chose to put some tables outside the circle
>>>> with some papers and markers. The second one is thinking they will
>>>> wheel in a table after the opening into the center, which seems
>>>> energetically disruptive.
>>>>
>>>> Have others encountered this? How did you deal with it?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks!
>>>> Harold
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Harold Shinsato
>>>> harold at shinsato.com <mailto:harold at shinsato.com>
>>>> http://shinsato.com
>>>> twitter: @hajush <http://twitter.com/hajush>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> OSList mailing list
>>>> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
>>>> <mailto:OSList at lists.openspacetech.org>
>>>> To unsubscribe send an email to
>>>> OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
>>>> <mailto:OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org>
>>>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
>>>>
>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>>>> <
>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org>
>>>> Past archives can be viewed here:
>>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/oslist@lists.openspacetech.org
>>>> <http://www.mail-archive.com/oslist@lists.openspacetech.org>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> OSList mailing list
>>> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
>>> <mailto:OSList at lists.openspacetech.org>
>>> To unsubscribe send an email to OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
>>> <http://openspacetech.org>
>>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
>>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>>> <http://openspacetech.org>
>>> Past archives can be viewed here:
>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/oslist@lists.openspacetech.org
>>> <mailto:oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> OSList mailing list
>>> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
>>> To unsubscribe send an email to OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
>>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
>>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>>> Past archives can be viewed here:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/oslist@lists.openspacetech.org
>>>
>>
>> --
>> Michael M Pannwitz
>> Draisweg 1, 12209 Berlin, Germany
>> ++49 - 30-772 8000
>>
>>
>>
>> Check out the Open Space World Map presently showing 414 resident Open
>> Space Workers in 68 countries working in a total of 144 countries
>> worldwide: www.openspaceworldmap.org
>> _______________________________________________
>> OSList mailing list
>> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
>> To unsubscribe send an email to OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>> Past archives can be viewed here:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/oslist@lists.openspacetech.org
>>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 14
> Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 08:18:08 -0700
> From: Chris Corrigan via OSList <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> To: Birgitt Williams <birgitt at dalarinternational.com>, World wide Open
> Space Technology email list <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> Subject: Re: [OSList] Accessibility concerns about bending down to
> pick up paper/pens
> Message-ID: <F2E3AAC4-E235-4A1F-A3C4-4D5B1BB16AFA at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> I often share the principle of "ask for what you need and offer what you can" with the idea that we should ensure that everyone who wishes to participate can do so. And that includes providing tranlastion for those that need it.
>
> Bottom line is to be as hospitable as you can and then encourage the group to look after each other.
>
> ___________
> CHRIS CORRIGAN
> www.chriscorrigan.com
>
>
>> On Aug 19, 2016, at 7:38 AM, Birgitt Williams via OSList <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org> wrote:
>>
>> Hi all,
>> I am choosing to answer a question that was not asked. The question is 'what is needed in our OST meetings to ensure that people who have disabilities of any sort can feel welcomed and included?'. Having worked with people with lots of different abilities and what are commonly referred to as disabilities...both obvious and invisible, there are some things our clients have recommended. Some of them are basic good manners of welcome as we would include in our homes.
>>
>> 1. For visually impaired, do not have markers/pens rolling around on the floor either in the middle or at the agenda wall...use some sort of container and explain to people why. For the blind, having a partner to assist throughout the process is helpful....it is amazing how much of an OST meeting depends on being able to see. For the deaf, arrange for people to sign...not just in the main room but in the breakout space....and if signing is no longer the best option with our advanced technology, do something that is current and helpful.
>> 2. For seniors and those taking medications who have difficulty seeing a typical printed report...have reports on flip chart paper with big print OR if printed on a computer, use 18 point or greater font...and double space.
>> 3. For the 10% of the population who gets headaches and other symptoms from scents/chemicals, use unscented markers/pens and in the invitation ask people to refrain from wearing any products with fragrances. Check the venue including restrooms/toilet areas to ensure no air fresheners are in use. If the venue uses pesticides, arrange with them ahead of time to refrain from spraying on day of meeting.
>> 4.For those with joints that don't bend so well, provide some kind of tables with markers/pens....maybe at the side...so that they can maintain as much independence as possible in getting the topics up.
>> 5. For those who have various allergies/intolerances/cultural needs with food, take care with beverages and food so that people are not being left out by the limited usually carbohydrate choices.
>>
>> I am not sure if I have remembered everything and would appreciate anything you all have figured out to add. While I respect that we create the conditions for self managing, a more equal playing field from the start that is welcoming to all is kind...and we can do with a little more kindness in this world.
>>
>> Blessings all,
>> Birgitt
>>
>>> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 10:11 AM Michael M Pannwitz via OSList <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org> wrote:
>>> I have seen people reject such help from others, especially with
>>> considerable verve from folks that one might consider differentially
>>> abled. One thing I have never seen is someone writing a thought for
>>> someone else.
>>> What happens regularly with younger children is that they will huddle
>>> and discuss an issue that they want to put on the paper.
>>>
>>> Considering the attempt to expand time and space for the force of
>>> selforganistion to show up in an OST event more clearly accompanied with
>>> some manifestation of selforganisation being the mode for participants I
>>> wonder what the least controlling, least prescreptive... mode might be
>>> for facilitation.
>>>
>>> Regarding the offering of issues I tell people very shortly after I have
>>> started my introduciton what I will invite them to later on... and I
>>> actually go through all the steps (walking to the center, getting on the
>>> floor, jotting down an issue, announcing it to the group, walking up to
>>> the bulletin board and posting it)... and then continue with my
>>> introduction. At the point of inviting for issues I have reduced my
>>> words to almost zero but I do make an inviting gesture towards the center...
>>>
>>> Greetings from Berlin
>>> mmp
>>>
>>> On 19.08.2016 15:28, MK Vidrine via OSList wrote:
>>>> I wonder if there would be any difference in results between inviting
>>>> people to ask their neighbors to help, and inviting people to offer help
>>>> to their neighbors? I'm imagining something like, "When you grab a piece
>>>> of paper, you could also get one for someone else nearby. After you
>>>> write down what you've got in mind, see if you can write down a thought
>>>> for a neighbor also- let's get as many written as we can."
>>>>
>>>> -MK
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 5:13 AM, Jennifer Hurley via OSList
>>>> <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org <mailto:oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I often say something in the opening like "if it's difficult for you
>>>> to bend over or you think your handwriting is too bad, ask one of
>>>> your neighbors to help." This also gives an easy out to anyone who
>>>> may be illiterate. I think it also fosters a sense of camaraderie.
>>>> But it doesn't make it 100% as easy for someone with physical or
>>>> literacy problems to participate, so it may not be the best answer.
>>>> I really resist tables inside the circle, though. I've had to do
>>>> several events that way, and there is definitely a negative impact
>>>> on the energy in the room.
>>>>
>>>> Jennifer Hurley
>>>> Hurley-Franks & Associates
>>>> 267-971-4598 <tel:267-971-4598>
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>
>>>> On Aug 19, 2016, at 12:27 AM, Harold Shinsato via OSList
>>>> <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org
>>>> <mailto:oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> In the many OST's I've participated in or helped open myself, I've
>>>>> encountered this complaint about having to bend over to pick up
>>>>> the pens and the papers in only two instances. Both of which were
>>>>> Universities. In both cases, the leading edge of the complaint
>>>>> seemed to have to do with women's dresses, but I also heard
>>>>> something about being "able" prejudiced.
>>>>>
>>>>> The first University chose to put some tables outside the circle
>>>>> with some papers and markers. The second one is thinking they will
>>>>> wheel in a table after the opening into the center, which seems
>>>>> energetically disruptive.
>>>>>
>>>>> Have others encountered this? How did you deal with it?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks!
>>>>> Harold
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Harold Shinsato
>>>>> harold at shinsato.com <mailto:harold at shinsato.com>
>>>>> http://shinsato.com
>>>>> twitter: @hajush <http://twitter.com/hajush>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> OSList mailing list
>>>>> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
>>>>> <mailto:OSList at lists.openspacetech.org>
>>>>> To unsubscribe send an email to
>>>>> OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
>>>>> <mailto:OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org>
>>>>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
>>>>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>>>>> <http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org>
>>>>> Past archives can be viewed here:
>>>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/oslist@lists.openspacetech.org
>>>>> <http://www.mail-archive.com/oslist@lists.openspacetech.org>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> OSList mailing list
>>>> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
>>>> <mailto:OSList at lists.openspacetech.org>
>>>> To unsubscribe send an email to OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
>>>> <http://openspacetech.org>
>>>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
>>>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>>>> <http://openspacetech.org>
>>>> Past archives can be viewed here:
>>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/oslist@lists.openspacetech.org
>>>> <mailto:oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> OSList mailing list
>>>> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
>>>> To unsubscribe send an email to OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
>>>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
>>>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>>>> Past archives can be viewed here: http://www.mail-archive.com/oslist@lists.openspacetech.org
>>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Michael M Pannwitz
>>> Draisweg 1, 12209 Berlin, Germany
>>> ++49 - 30-772 8000
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Check out the Open Space World Map presently showing 414 resident Open
>>> Space Workers in 68 countries working in a total of 144 countries
>>> worldwide: www.openspaceworldmap.org
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> OSList mailing list
>>> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
>>> To unsubscribe send an email to OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
>>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
>>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>>> Past archives can be viewed here: http://www.mail-archive.com/oslist@lists.openspacetech.org
>> _______________________________________________
>> OSList mailing list
>> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
>> To unsubscribe send an email to OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>> Past archives can be viewed here: http://www.mail-archive.com/oslist@lists.openspacetech.org
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 15
> Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2016 18:10:59 +0200
> From: Koos de Heer via OSList <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> To: "'World wide Open Space Technology email list'"
> <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> Subject: Re: [OSList] Accessibility concerns about bending down to
> pick up paper/pens
> Message-ID: <004601d1fa34$469617a0$d3c246e0$@auryn.nl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> As far as I can remember, it has never been a problem. Surely folks have complained, but I am with Harrison on this one: the ones to complain in my experience were not the ones with serious disabilities, merely people suffering from indignation: ?Are you really asking ME to bend down to the FLOOR?? I am afraid that I have a disability here myself: I find it very difficult to make space or to organize for this. The people who had arthritis or a short skirt (or even a wheelchair) always found a solution quickly.
>
>
>
> I feel that the more I try to organize, the more I am in the way of the self organizing of the group. Of course I need to provide conditions, but there is a balance between providing conditions and pampering. Pampering is not a good condition for self organization. I try to tell myself that the people who are invited are incredibly welcome and incredibly powerful. That includes finding solutions for practical problems. If I try to predict and organize for every possible problem, I work way too hard and I don?t trust the folks in the room.
>
>
>
> I once had a deaf person attending. She contacted us beforehand, announced that she would bring her own sign language interpreter and asked us to help make this possible. So we made sure they could both sit in such a way that the interpreting would work well.
>
>
>
> A co-worker once organized an Open Space event where a number of police and government hot shots would attend. The organizing committee (including my coworker) decided to put tables in the middle because they felt it was impossible to ask these high ranked officials to bend over or sit on the floor. I thought it looked awful and I did not like the energy in the circle.
>
>
> A year or so later, I had two Open Space events for that same police and some other organizations, again including a number of stripes and stars. I did not do any tables, just everything on the floor, and nobody complained. Everybody took part and everybody loved the energy and creativity of the group.
>
>
>
> Koos
>
>
>
> Van: OSList [mailto:oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org] Namens Chris Corrigan via OSList
> Verzonden: vrijdag 19 augustus 2016 17:18
> Aan: Birgitt Williams <birgitt at dalarinternational.com>; World wide Open Space Technology email list <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> Onderwerp: Re: [OSList] Accessibility concerns about bending down to pick up paper/pens
>
>
>
> I often share the principle of "ask for what you need and offer what you can" with the idea that we should ensure that everyone who wishes to participate can do so. And that includes providing tranlastion for those that need it.
>
>
>
> Bottom line is to be as hospitable as you can and then encourage the group to look after each other.
>
> ___________
>
> CHRIS CORRIGAN
>
> www.chriscorrigan.com <http://www.chriscorrigan.com>
>
>
>
>
> On Aug 19, 2016, at 7:38 AM, Birgitt Williams via OSList <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org <mailto:oslist at lists.openspacetech.org> > wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> I am choosing to answer a question that was not asked. The question is 'what is needed in our OST meetings to ensure that people who have disabilities of any sort can feel welcomed and included?'. Having worked with people with lots of different abilities and what are commonly referred to as disabilities...both obvious and invisible, there are some things our clients have recommended. Some of them are basic good manners of welcome as we would include in our homes.
>
>
>
> 1. For visually impaired, do not have markers/pens rolling around on the floor either in the middle or at the agenda wall...use some sort of container and explain to people why. For the blind, having a partner to assist throughout the process is helpful....it is amazing how much of an OST meeting depends on being able to see. For the deaf, arrange for people to sign...not just in the main room but in the breakout space....and if signing is no longer the best option with our advanced technology, do something that is current and helpful.
>
> 2. For seniors and those taking medications who have difficulty seeing a typical printed report...have reports on flip chart paper with big print OR if printed on a computer, use 18 point or greater font...and double space.
>
> 3. For the 10% of the population who gets headaches and other symptoms from scents/chemicals, use unscented markers/pens and in the invitation ask people to refrain from wearing any products with fragrances. Check the venue including restrooms/toilet areas to ensure no air fresheners are in use. If the venue uses pesticides, arrange with them ahead of time to refrain from spraying on day of meeting.
>
> 4.For those with joints that don't bend so well, provide some kind of tables with markers/pens....maybe at the side...so that they can maintain as much independence as possible in getting the topics up.
>
> 5. For those who have various allergies/intolerances/cultural needs with food, take care with beverages and food so that people are not being left out by the limited usually carbohydrate choices.
>
>
>
> I am not sure if I have remembered everything and would appreciate anything you all have figured out to add. While I respect that we create the conditions for self managing, a more equal playing field from the start that is welcoming to all is kind...and we can do with a little more kindness in this world.
>
>
>
> Blessings all,
>
> Birgitt
>
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 10:11 AM Michael M Pannwitz via OSList <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org <mailto:oslist at lists.openspacetech.org> > wrote:
>
> I have seen people reject such help from others, especially with
> considerable verve from folks that one might consider differentially
> abled. One thing I have never seen is someone writing a thought for
> someone else.
> What happens regularly with younger children is that they will huddle
> and discuss an issue that they want to put on the paper.
>
> Considering the attempt to expand time and space for the force of
> selforganistion to show up in an OST event more clearly accompanied with
> some manifestation of selforganisation being the mode for participants I
> wonder what the least controlling, least prescreptive... mode might be
> for facilitation.
>
> Regarding the offering of issues I tell people very shortly after I have
> started my introduciton what I will invite them to later on... and I
> actually go through all the steps (walking to the center, getting on the
> floor, jotting down an issue, announcing it to the group, walking up to
> the bulletin board and posting it)... and then continue with my
> introduction. At the point of inviting for issues I have reduced my
> words to almost zero but I do make an inviting gesture towards the center...
>
> Greetings from Berlin
> mmp
>
> On 19.08.2016 15:28, MK Vidrine via OSList wrote:
>> I wonder if there would be any difference in results between inviting
>> people to ask their neighbors to help, and inviting people to offer help
>> to their neighbors? I'm imagining something like, "When you grab a piece
>> of paper, you could also get one for someone else nearby. After you
>> write down what you've got in mind, see if you can write down a thought
>> for a neighbor also- let's get as many written as we can."
>>
>> -MK
>>
>> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 5:13 AM, Jennifer Hurley via OSList
>> <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org <mailto:oslist at lists.openspacetech.org> <mailto:oslist at lists.openspacetech.org <mailto:oslist at lists.openspacetech.org> >>
>> wrote:
>>
>> I often say something in the opening like "if it's difficult for you
>> to bend over or you think your handwriting is too bad, ask one of
>> your neighbors to help." This also gives an easy out to anyone who
>> may be illiterate. I think it also fosters a sense of camaraderie.
>> But it doesn't make it 100% as easy for someone with physical or
>> literacy problems to participate, so it may not be the best answer.
>> I really resist tables inside the circle, though. I've had to do
>> several events that way, and there is definitely a negative impact
>> on the energy in the room.
>>
>> Jennifer Hurley
>> Hurley-Franks & Associates
>> 267-971-4598 <tel:267-971-4598>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Aug 19, 2016, at 12:27 AM, Harold Shinsato via OSList
>> <oslist at lists.openspacetech.org <mailto:oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
>> <mailto:oslist at lists.openspacetech.org <mailto:oslist at lists.openspacetech.org> >> wrote:
>>
>>> In the many OST's I've participated in or helped open myself, I've
>>> encountered this complaint about having to bend over to pick up
>>> the pens and the papers in only two instances. Both of which were
>>> Universities. In both cases, the leading edge of the complaint
>>> seemed to have to do with women's dresses, but I also heard
>>> something about being "able" prejudiced.
>>>
>>> The first University chose to put some tables outside the circle
>>> with some papers and markers. The second one is thinking they will
>>> wheel in a table after the opening into the center, which seems
>>> energetically disruptive.
>>>
>>> Have others encountered this? How did you deal with it?
>>>
>>> Thanks!
>>> Harold
>>>
>>> --
>>> Harold Shinsato
>>> harold at shinsato.com <mailto:harold at shinsato.com> <mailto:harold at shinsato.com <mailto:harold at shinsato.com> >
>>> http://shinsato.com
>>> twitter: @hajush <http://twitter.com/hajush>
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>
> --
> Michael M Pannwitz
> Draisweg 1, 12209 Berlin, Germany
> ++49 - 30-772 8000
>
>
>
> Check out the Open Space World Map presently showing 414 resident Open
> Space Workers in 68 countries working in a total of 144 countries
> worldwide: www.openspaceworldmap.org <http://www.openspaceworldmap.org>
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