[OSList] Intro and inquiry: Open Space with some off-limits topics

Thu Jul 14 18:16:26 PDT 2011

Artur,

Just to make sure I understand your question.  Are you asking me why I bring
up "givens" at all with the client. Isn't the theme enough?

I will answer it on that basis, hoping I have understood it correctly.

What this posting brought in sharper focus for me is that discussions about
givens, off-limits or boundaries, are not about negotiating them in or out.
It's simply about putting certain topics on the table in the pre-work so
that there is a deeper understanding of self-organizing when it happens in
Open Space. Givens and such are all veiled ways of trying to control.

On the recent New Jersey event, www.creativenj.org, these sensitive topics
did come up at different times with the host team. It was not easy to
describe "letting go" and "no let's not do that, here's why".

I'll admit that people on the host team did not always understand the
importance of those conversations...until later, at the event and after the
event.  It was heartwarming to hear them acknowledge the benefit of those
exchanges later.

I hope I clarified what I was thinking and if not, well sometimes I confuse
myself too!

Obrigado Artur,

Suzanne

On Thu, Jul 14, 2011 at 5:31 PM, Artur Silva <arturfsilva at yahoo.com> wrote:

> Dear Suzanne:****
>
> ** **
>
> I have not understood your conclusion... Sorry... ****
>
> ** **
>
> If you make pre-work sessions on the "general conditions of the situation"
> (to decide if OST is the appropriate method, what shall be the theme, etc.),
> isn't it enough?****
>
> ** **
>
> Why do you feel a need to discuss givens, boundaries or limits? They will
> come out any way, or I am wrong?****
>
> ** **
>
> I remember, some years ago, I have been invited to facilitate an Open Space
> session. Speaking with the sponsor I came to understand that: 1) this was
> part of an EU program, and they were going to use OST because "it was
> imposed by the rules of the program"; 2) the theme, already defined,
> wouldn't stimulate any passion from the people invited. The "givens" were
> clear without even pronouncing the word... I have refused to facilitate the
> session that has been later facilitated by a more junior facilitator, that
> probably has now this "international session" in her Portfolio...****
>
> ** **
>
> Beijos e abraços****
>
> ** **
>
> Artur****
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* Suzanne Daigle <sdaigle4 at gmail.com>
>
> *To:* World wide Open Space Technology email list <
> oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
> *Sent:* Thu, July 14, 2011 3:16:48 PM
>
> *Subject:* Re: [OSList] Intro and inquiry: Open Space with some off-limits
> topics
>
> Dan, Harrison, Chris, and Artur,
>
> Thank you for this discussion. Yes..."givens" close space and do bring the
> elephant in the room bigger than it would have been without givens. What I
> realized this morning however is that the "givens" conversation is about a
> lot more than having or not having "givens".
>
> When a Host or Sponsor puts limits on participants at the beginning of an
> Open Space, it unconsciously conveys:  "I'm in charge and I/we have
> decided...." or  "We or someone here knows better than you what you should
> talk about".
>
> It's the complete opposite of what we are inviting. As leaders and
> participants we are so programmed this way.  We expect "boundaries" from our
> leaders and leaders expect it is their responsibility to "set those
> boundaries".
>
> As a facilitator, I'll admit that I had bought into the possibility that
> there might be rare instances  where having " a few givens" would make
> sense. In corporate situations for example, givens like: "no we can't spend
> millions that we don't have so big budget items should be off the table" or
> "we won't be reorganizing the organization".  I cringe now think that this
> was another way of saying "Let's not waste our time having THOSE
> discussions".
>
>  As I imagine myself a participant listening to these admonitions, I really
> don't like how it makes me feel....*less!*  As if I don't  have the
> intellect, maturity and smarts to know that myself and then who knows
> maybe a big bucks project will come up as a topic, money will be found and
> the company will be saved.
>
> I'm not chastising the leaders; we're all guilty in expecting and accepting
> givens, boundaries that limit passion and accountability.
>
> So suddenly because of this discussion on the OS list, this topic for me is
> not about "givens" anymore, it's about my intention as a facilitator  and
> with others to be "holding the space for everyone (leaders and
> participants)" starting from that first discussion with the client through
> the planning to the actual Open Space event and beyond.
>
> While I may not want "givens", I do want the *conversation *on "givens".
> It's an opportunity to share with the client and host team what it means to
> be opening space in the organization. It's about self organization and
> shared leadership leading to higher performance! Something dormant that's
> been there for quite awhile that we've forgotten how to tap into.
>
> I am so grateful to you all for this breakthrough insight in me on
> "givens".
>
> Thank you.
>
> Suzanne
>
> *NuFocus Strategic Group *
> 7159 Victoria Circle
>
> University Park, FL 34201
>
> www.nufocusgroup.com
>
>
> <http://www.nufocusgroup.com>
>
>
> On Thu, Jul 14, 2011 at 6:21 AM, Artur Silva <arturfsilva at yahoo.com>wrote:
>
>> Hi Dan:
>>
>> Thanks for your question.
>>
>> I agree with Harrison and Chris.
>>
>> Many, many moons ago, we had 2 discussions about a related question. Shall
>> we (or not) define with the client what are the "Givens". The reason I have
>> been (and I still am) strongly against that practice, is that when we define
>> some givens in the beginning we are "closing the space", and those "givens"
>> will be discussed during the coffee breaks, at night, etc.
>>
>> Best regards from a sunny Lisbon
>>
>> Artur
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> *From:* "Chris Altmikus @ iDeA-Link" <chris.altmikus at idea-link.eu>
>> *To:* World wide Open Space Technology email list <
>> oslist at lists.openspacetech.org>
>> *Sent:* Wed, July 13, 2011 2:16:51 PM
>> *Subject:* Re: [OSList] Intro and inquiry: Open Space with some
>> off-limits topics
>>
>> Hi Dan,
>>
>> My experience is that off-limit subjects are "in" as soon as you put them
>> explicitly "off-limits". And that's in Open Space as well as in numerous
>> other contexts.
>>
>> What does your mind dwell on, if I ask you to *NOT* think of a pink
>> elephant... It would appear that our sub-consciousness simply does not
>> recognize negatives.
>>
>> Best regards   +   Chris
>>
>>  *iDeA Coaching @ iDeA-Link*
>>
>> *La Bovarde 37*
>>
>> *1091 Grandvaux*
>>
>> *Suisse*
>>
>>  **
>>
>> *+41 33 533 31 34*
>>
>> *+41 78 935 31 34*
>>
>> *Chris.Altmikus at iDeA-Link.eu*
>>
>>
>>
>> Le 13 juil. 2011 à 15:08, Harrison Owen a écrit :
>>
>> Welcome Dan!
>>
>> Restricting conversation is something that some people have tried. And I
>> guess they think it works. But that has never been my experience. Of
>> course,
>> every Open Space needs a theme to define the general area of discourse.
>> That, after all, is why people come -- or don't. Your Agile community
>> would
>> scarcely show up for a gathering focused on "The Future of American
>> Dentistry." And I doubt that the dentists would be too intrigued with the
>> "Agile Passions."
>>
>> But once the general theme has been determined, everything else is "fair
>> game" in my book. The reasons are several. First, when you limit the areas
>> of exploration you also limit the possibility of innovation and renewal,
>> which in my book is the major objective. And if it isn't -- why get
>> together
>> anyhow?
>>
>> A second reason, which is the clincher for me... is that even if you tell
>> everybody that "certain areas" are off limits -- there is not much chance
>> that they will actually pay attention. Especially if the areas are
>> interesting. As a matter of fact, I suspect that by proscribing certain
>> discussion, you actually insure that it will come up. I guess you could
>> call
>> that the "forbidden fruit" syndrome. Or maybe "beans in the nose" (Never
>> tell a child not to put beans in their nose, because they will surely do
>> it.)
>>
>> So the "forbidden fruit" will be discussed, but perhaps not publically.
>> And
>> that just creates more problems. I think that is the way you grow
>> elephants,
>> and other nasty creatures that lurk in the shadows.
>>
>> So I have never found any reason or profit in limiting the conversation.
>>
>> Harrison
>>
>> Harrison Owen
>> 7808 River Falls Dr.
>> Potomac, MD 20854
>> USA
>>
>> 189 Beaucaire Ave. (summer)
>> Camden, Maine 20854
>>
>> Phone 301-365-2093
>> (summer)  207-763-3261
>>
>> www.openspaceworld.com
>> www.ho-image.com (Personal Website)
>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of
>> OSLIST
>> Go to:
>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org
>> [mailto:oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org] On Behalf Of Dan Mezick
>> Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2011 11:30 AM
>> To: oslist at lists.openspacetech.org
>> Subject: [OSList] Intro and inquiry: Open Space with some off-limits
>> topics
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I am a respectful lurker who now has an inquiry, so it is time to
>> introduce myself.
>>
>> Hi! I am Dan Mezick, coach to Agile teams, their sponsors, and executive
>> management. I live in CT. I am friendly, curious and playful. I enjoy
>> conducting frequent experiments. I like to be surprised and learn.  I
>> have a history of software development. I receive a software patent in
>> 1999.  In 2003, I run an elaborate search engine optimization experiment
>> that results in over 120,000 unsolicited, incoming web links from all
>> around the world, in 20 days. Those 120,00++ links-in result in a #1
>> Google rank for over 7 years.
>>
>> Now I am curious about Open Space. I play with it. I read all the books
>> from Harrison. I experience many surprises as I read these books.  I
>> convene five OST events in Boston since 2009. The largest is the Agile
>> Boston Open Space in Sept 2010 where 275 people participate. I have
>> experience directly facilitating some smaller OST meetings for clients
>> recently.
>>
>> I am currently quite fascinated with Open Space and OST dynamics.
>>
>> This list is very awesome and awe-inspiring. I am very happy to be here.
>>
>> If you like to be surprised, you may enjoy this:
>> http://sprott.physics.wisc.edu/pickover/esp.html
>>
>>
>> Here is my inquiry:
>>
>>
>> My Inquiry
>> =========
>>
>> "Let' s not go there."
>>
>> This is a common utterance used in conversation, one that clearly
>> signals that the space is closed to that topic.
>>
>> Open Space, limited by only a broad Theme, is not very limiting.
>> Authority often is concerned with this wide-ranging freedom to explore
>> "just about anything" when considering OST, and what might result from
>> that afterward.
>>
>> I wonder if any of us have experience with doing OST with some sections
>> in the discussion-space explicitly closed.
>>
>> I wonder how these limits are expressed-in-fact; for example inside the
>> Invite or in the composition of the Theme.
>>
>> I wonder how the "explicitly stated as closed" space is then
>> successfully maintained in an OST setting. I then wonder how much fun
>> the event is, when some space is closed.
>>
>> I wonder also, if this is an oxymoron, that just does not work very
>> well, ever.
>>
>> I think have read here somewhere here, in a passing comment, that
>> sometimes, certain topics are closed in OS meeting.
>>
>> I wonder if anyone has experience trying this, and if any specific
>> knowledge about this is documented explicitly anywhere.
>>
>> Thank you for your help ! I am preparing to be surprised.
>> _______________________________________________
>> OSList mailing list
>> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
>> To unsubscribe send an email to OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> OSList mailing list
>> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
>> To unsubscribe send an email to OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> OSList mailing list
>> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
>> To unsubscribe send an email to OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Suzanne Daigle
> NuFocus Strategic Group
> 7159 Victoria Circle
> University Park, FL 34201
> FL 941-359-8877;
> CT 203-722-2009
> www.nufocusgroup.com
> s.daigle at nufocusgroup.com
> twitter @suzannedaigle
>
> Potomac, MD 20854
> USA
>
> 189 Beaucaire Ave. (summer)
> Camden, Maine 20854
>
> Phone 301-365-2093
> (summer)  207-763-3261
>
> www.openspaceworld.com
> www.ho-image.com (Personal Website)
> To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of OSLIST
> Go to:http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org
> [mailto:oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org] On Behalf Of Dan Mezick
> Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2011 11:30 AM
> To: oslist at lists.openspacetech.org
> Subject: [OSList] Intro and inquiry: Open Space with some off-limits topics
>
> Hi,
>
> I am a respectful lurker who now has an inquiry, so it is time to
> introduce myself.
>
> Hi! I am Dan Mezick, coach to Agile teams, their sponsors, and executive
> management. I live in CT. I am friendly, curious and playful. I enjoy
> conducting frequent experiments. I like to be surprised and learn.  I
> have a history of software development. I receive a software patent in
> 1999.  In 2003, I run an elaborate search engine optimization experiment
> that results in over 120,000 unsolicited, incoming web links from all
> around the world, in 20 days. Those 120,00++ links-in result in a #1
> Google rank for over 7 years.
>
> Now I am curious about Open Space. I play with it. I read all the books
> from Harrison. I experience many surprises as I read these books.  I
> convene five OST events in Boston since 2009. The largest is the Agile
> Boston Open Space in Sept 2010 where 275 people participate. I have
> experience directly facilitating some smaller OST meetings for clients
> recently.
>
> I am currently quite fascinated with Open Space and OST dynamics.
>
> This list is very awesome and awe-inspiring. I am very happy to be here.
>
> If you like to be surprised, you may enjoy this:
> http://sprott.physics.wisc.edu/pickover/esp.html
>
>
> Here is my inquiry:
>
>
> My Inquiry
> =========
>
> "Let' s not go there."
>
> This is a common utterance used in conversation, one that clearly
> signals that the space is closed to that topic.
>
> Open Space, limited by only a broad Theme, is not very limiting.
> Authority often is concerned with this wide-ranging freedom to explore
> "just about anything" when considering OST, and what might result from
> that afterward.
>
> I wonder if any of us have experience with doing OST with some sections
> in the discussion-space explicitly closed.
>
> I wonder how these limits are expressed-in-fact; for example inside the
> Invite or in the composition of the Theme.
>
> I wonder how the "explicitly stated as closed" space is then
> successfully maintained in an OST setting. I then wonder how much fun
> the event is, when some space is closed.
>
> I wonder also, if this is an oxymoron, that just does not work very
> well, ever.
>
> I think have read here somewhere here, in a passing comment, that
> sometimes, certain topics are closed in OS meeting.
>
> I wonder if anyone has experience trying this, and if any specific
> knowledge about this is documented explicitly anywhere.
>
> Thank you for your help ! I am preparing to be surprised.
> _______________________________________________
> OSList mailing list
> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
> To unsubscribe send an email to OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OSList mailing list
> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
> To unsubscribe send an email to OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OSList mailing list
> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
> To unsubscribe send an email to OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>
>
>
>
> --
> Suzanne Daigle
> NuFocus Strategic Group
> 7159 Victoria Circle
> University Park, FL 34201
> FL 941-359-8877;
> CT 203-722-2009
> www.nufocusgroup.com
> s.daigle at nufocusgroup.com
> twitter @suzannedaigle
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OSList mailing list
> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
> To unsubscribe send an email to OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>
>

-- 
Suzanne Daigle
NuFocus Strategic Group
7159 Victoria Circle
University Park, FL 34201
FL 941-359-8877;
CT 203-722-2009
www.nufocusgroup.com
s.daigle at nufocusgroup.com
twitter @suzannedaigle
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