[OSList] Individual and collective master (was: OST - Open Systems Thinking)

Wed Dec 14 08:51:39 PST 2011

Bernhard—Far from inappropriate, I think the thoughts/question you offer are
spot on – to quote the Brits. I do confess to a certain sensitivity when
speaking of OS and possible “spiritual” connections if only because some
folks seem convinced that the whole experience is whacky, and would just
love to consign it to that lovely box, “Cult Fetish.” That done, they can
quickly return to their standard practice of managing, organizing, and being
in organizations – doing more of what they have always done and getting the
same miserable results. And that IS a value judgment! Sorry about that L

All that said, I have for years been intrigued, to put it mildly, with the
apparent connection/similarity between the reported effects of the several
global “Practices” – Buddhism for one, but there are many others – and the
common experience in Open Space. At a personal level, and particularly when
it comes to facilitating an Open Space, I have found my own meditative
practice to be critically essential. Several years ago when doing some work
in Japan, my host asked if there was anything he could do for me. I replied
that spending several days with a Zen Master would be terrific. I did and it
was. 

Under the heading of full disclosure, be it known that I am an Anglican
(Episcopalian) Priest, and have been for 50+ years, although truth to tell,
I haven’t been connected to a church for a long time. With such a history,
one might reasonably suspect a certain bias, which doubtless exists – but in
my case it feels more like an enhanced sensitivity to things that happen in
realms of our experience not rigidly defined, or necessarily accepted by,
the Western Scientific mind.  Don’t get me wrong, I am an avid follower of
science at its best, be that physics, biology, cosmology
 And by the way did
you catch the latest scoop on the Higgs Boson? Might even exist! I do find
myself smiling, however when some of my “sciency” friends chide me for my
esoteric interests and strange language. These are the same folks who go
into rhapsody over Quarks, Up and Down -- and spend endless hours of debate
as to whether the essential elements of the Cosmos are points, strings, or
banes! And how about 11 time/space dimensions?

I admit that I did get a little upset several years ago when a died in the
wool, hardnosed, secular materialist (his description) backed me in a corner
and accused me of trying to create a new religion – and of course he was
talking about Open Space. But then I knew I had him. I confessed that OST
was indeed spirit inspired. However, his victory smile went south when I
added that the essential spirit bore the label, “Beefeaters” – and that two
very stiff snorts did the job.

All joking aside, Bernhard – from where I sit the issues you raise are
relevant, interesting, and thought provoking. In truth we have been there
before over the years here on OSLIST, but now would be a wonderful time for
a deeper re-visit. I’m on.

Harrison  

Harrison Owen

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USA

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Camden, Maine 20854

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www.ho-image.com (Personal Website)

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From: oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org
[mailto:oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org] On Behalf Of Bernhard Weber
Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2011 12:13 AM
To: World wide Open Space Technology email list
Subject: [OSList] Individual and collective master (was: OST - Open Systems
Thinking)

Harrison and all

I like the recently upcoming discussion about the history of Systems
Thinking, but I would also like to make a big jump from this. 

I am not shure, but to me it seems to not be by pure "accident". 

1. Recently Stanley park wrote "Now is the territory of Peace- Nirvana" 

2. And some days later you Harrison wrote "Open the space of your life and
the lives of those around you, and you will discover your own natural
state". 

"Your own natural state", that is exactly how Buddhist masters (like e.g.
Chögyal Namkhai Norbu Rinpoche, the contemporary Tibetan Dzogchen-teacher)
refer to what is often called enlightenment, liberation, Rigpa, ... 

Although it is not really possible to "feel" something behind the words of a
written posting, I always felt some kind of reluctance by side of you, when
somebody in the group related the effects of OST or the OS spirit to central
Buddhist concepts. Would you prefer to not discuss it (treat it as a tabu)
or am I completely wrong here? (And my feeling demasked as pseudo-feeling;-)

I am here in Sri Lanka at the beginning of the 7th year of residence, the
place/space where Gautamas words have been put into Pali language and
written down some hundreds of years after his passing away/paranirvana. So
all this is resonating in me as a kind of effect of the Spirit of the
space/genius loci. 

Anyhow I would like to invite you and all to explore, if the following idea
makes sense: 

What the two citations above seem to hint at in my eyes , is a quite
specific function/effect of Open Space: being a trigger for processes during
which not only things get done, as it has been pointed out again and again,
but a trigger for processes that may also lead to enlightenment. If there is
some value in that idea, then OS might be a collective equivalent of a
master

A master also can only be a trigger, because as already the historical
Gautama (called the Buddha) stated, that he can, on basis of his own
experience only show the way, point to the right direction, but the
practitioner has to do the work. There is no way that the master can do it
(the full liberation, the reaching of the natural state) for the student.

So I am wondering if the efficiency and effectiveness of OST in getting
things done, is not intrinsicly knitted together with (alias dialectically
connected to) this "collective master function". Two sides of one medal?

Of course I am not interested to tie OS to Buddhism as a belief system. 

But of course my understanding of the ways to enlightenment is also not tied
to a specific belief system. I have luckily been exposed to "passion,
responsability and love " in- and outside of OST in various cultures like my
own Christian culture in Austria, Candomblé in Brazil, animistic cults (as
the christians call them) in Africa, Buddhism of the Theravada, Mahayana,
and Tibetan tradition (Buddhism fused with Bön), Yoga in India...  And it
always works and in all kinds of places.

So once again: might it be legitimate, make sense and be useful to look at
OST as a kind of set up for a collective master without a present individual
guru?

Or not?

Bernd/Colombo

. 

Bernd Weber

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Am 13.12.2011 um 22:11 schrieb Harrison Owen:

discover your own natural state

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