Anti Laws of OST - Foundations of OST?

Wed May 27 14:53:30 PDT 2009

Harrison, Larry and all:

I am afraid that I continue to read only the messages from this list from time to time...

Today, I read this answer from Harrison to a reply from Larry to an original comment by Harrison. The 3 messages referred are listed below, and I ask you to first read the parts of those messages that I have transformed in bold.

(...) Thanks for having done that ;-)

Now, I am happy that Harrison agrees that "the 4 principles and one law are neither laws nor principles actually" and that there will come a day when The Law and The Principles can be assigned to that wonderful status of “One more thing not to do.”

But Larry commented, very wisely as usual, about the importance of some form of “boundaries” or “container” for self-organization. 

So, maybe it is the appropriate time to reintroduce a discussion that I have tried to introduce many moons ago, about what are the foundations of OST. 

I mean, 

1) if the principles are not "principles" after all, but only what always happens, and eventually even "one more thing not to do" (and I remember you that I have done some OST experiments without reference to the Principles - and all went well as usual), but

2) Some form of boundary or container is needed 

where this boundary or container does comes from?  

I have proposed to call that the "foundations" (not principles) of OST and proposed some ideas (that are only preliminary ideas) I would like to read (again) your opinions about.

You can found my (preliminary) proposals, of some time ago, here 
http://www.openspaceworld.org/cgi/netwiki.cgi?FoundationsofOST

and here 

http://listserv.boisestate.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind0401&L=oslist&P=R23925&I=-3&X=6543D44B5D0A7C3BC4&Y=arturfsilva%40yahoo.com.

Looking forward to hear from you all

Warn regards from a warm night in Lisbon

Artur

------

--- On Wed, 5/27/09, Harrison Owen <hhowen at verizon.net> wrote:

From: Harrison Owen <hhowen at verizon.net>
Subject: Re: [OSLIST] Anti Laws of OST
To: OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU
Date: Wednesday, May 27, 2009, 7:23 AM

Right on Larry – and I found a very curious and embarrassing typo in my small piece. I said, “They (the Principles and the Law) are descriptive as opposed to descriptive.” I meant to say,”They are descriptive as opposed to prescriptive.” Point is neither the Law nor the Principles tell you what to do – they simply alert everybody to what will be taking place no matter what. I think that is a useful function, but it really doesn’t change a thing. In short – there will come a day when The Law and The Principles can be assigned to that wonderful status of “One more thing not to do.”

Harrison 

Harrison Owen
7808 River Falls Drive
Potomac, Maryland   20854
Phone 301-365-2093
Skype hhowen
Open Space Training www.openspaceworld.com 
Open Space Institute www.openspaceworld.org
Personal website www.ho-image.com 
OSLIST: To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives Visit: www.listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html

-----Original Message-----
From: OSLIST [mailto:OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU] On Behalf Of Larry Peterson
Sent: Wednesday, May 27, 2009 9:44 AM
To: OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU
Subject: Re: Anti Laws of OST

For me, there is more sense in the “Principles and Law” than non-sense.  Stewart Kauffman explores the importance of some form of “boundaries” or “container” for self-organization, particularly that of cells.  He believes (with strong scientific evidence) that real physical work only gets done within some “boundaries” or it dissipates.  Cells, he asserts, co-create their “boundaries” with their environment through self-organizing relationships in every moment.  The boundaries are permeable, constructs, open to interchange with their environment. (No such thing as a closed system!)

Harrison, I believe you have articulated a set of socially constructed permeable “boundaries” for enhancing human self-organization – including the focus/theme, principles and law.  These set a temporary set of “boundaries” or a “container” both focused and open that change the perceived conditions for self-organization at an event or meeting.  Self-organization is happening all the time, in every moment.  Our mental maps (in practice) and feelings shape what we do as we self-organize – what topics we propose and who we connect to.  Are they necessary for self-organization (Open Space) – no, it is happening all the time as order emerges.  Do they (or other similar statements about the social framework for our self-organizing) help people to self-organize in exciting and creative ways?  I think so.

Larry

Larry Peterson & Associates in Transformation
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
larry at spiritedorg.com   416.653.4829 http://www.spiritedorg.com

From: OSLIST [mailto:OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU] On Behalf Of Harrison Owen
Sent: May-25-09 2:59 PM
To: OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU
Subject: Re: [OSLIST] Anti Laws of OST

Just to render the whole thing non-sensical, the 4 principles and one law are neither laws nor principles actually. To be honest they are just my (and others’) observations of what seemed to be happening in any case. In a word they are descriptive as opposed to descriptive – You could say it is all a joke. Rather like “technology” in the phrase Open Space Technology. The joke, however turned out to be outrageously funny – because somehow or another truth broke through. We are in serious trouble! Everybody knows that what happens in Open Space simply can’t happen. Unfortunately it does – and that makes a joke out of a whole mess of other stuff – like most of what we think we know about meetings, the management of meetings, and management itself. Double trouble!!

Harrison

Harrison Owen
7808 River Falls Drive
Potomac, Maryland   20854
Phone 301-365-2093
Skype hhowen
Open Space Training www.openspaceworld.com 
Open Space Institute www.openspaceworld.org
Personal website www.ho-image.com 
OSLIST: To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives Visit: www.listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html
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