Sages and Such

Tue May 29 13:29:14 PDT 2007

Harrison,

Thank you for the invitation to question! I had never noticed the word
"sage" on the list until John Engle used it. I could hazard a guess or two
as to what it means, but I'd sure love to hear someone explain what it means
 here.

Warmly,
Raffi

p.s. congratulations to the Kyiv WOSonOS team on the conference. I enjoyed
looking at the photos!

p.p.s. And a thank you to my Northern California neighbor, the Fabulous Lisa
Heft, for the offer to host WOSonOS XVI!

*
*
==========================================================
OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU
------------------------------
To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options,
view the archives of oslist at listserv.boisestate.edu:
http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html

To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs:
http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist

>From  Tue May 29 16:21:32 2007
Message-Id: <TUE.29.MAY.2007.162132.0400.>
Date: Tue, 29 May 2007 16:21:32 -0400
Reply-To: hhowen at verizon.net
To: OSLIST <OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU>
From: Harrison Owen <hhowen at verizon.net>
Organization: HH Owen and Co.
Subject: Re: doing self-organization - OST "foundations"
In-Reply-To: <876202.69268.qm at web54601.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: multipart/alternative;
 boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0007_01C7A20D.6F3705E0"

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C7A20D.6F3705E0
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Artur - great to see you here! I could ask where you have been hiding, but I
am afraid you might tell me. :-)

I'm curious why do you include the Law of Two Feet under the heading of
"micro-rule," but not the Four Principles?

Harrison

Harrison Owen

7808 River Falls Drive

Potomac, Maryland   20854

Phone 301-365-2093

Skype hhowen

Open Space Training  <http://www.openspaceworld.com/> www.openspaceworld.com

Open Space Institute  <http://www.openspaceworld.org/>
www.openspaceworld.org

Personal website  <http://www.ho-image.com/> www.ho-image.com 

OSLIST: To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives
Visit:  <http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html>
www.listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html

-----Original Message-----
From: OSLIST [mailto:OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU] On Behalf Of Artur
Silva
Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 8:38 AM
To: OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU
Subject: Re: doing self-organization - OST "foundations"

[Very quickly with no time for revision.]

Interesting threat.

I also believe that self-organization, in its relation with complex adaptive
systems, is fundamental to OST.  

In voluntary emergent Systems there are normally micro rules that allow for
self organization to emerge at a macro level.

So this thread can be a good way to look for those micro rules.

When we ask "Why does OST works?" there are a lot of micro rules that are
"imposed" in OST "by design". 

I would also agree that "invitation" is one of those.

Bur there are others that are so evident that we don't think about them
anymore when we refer to OST.

Like diversity (the invitation being sent to all the interested
stakeholders).

Like the circle in all types of sessions (allowing for equality and for
conections/relationships, etc)

The posting of themes (people are again invited, but not forced)

The break out session procedures.

The law of two feet.

Etc

What I would not consider as "foundations of OST" (when we think at a micro
level) are the so called principles. If they exist at all, I think they are
a macro effect of what I am calling the foundations.

They occur (as many other astonishing things) when some very easy and simple
micro rules are followed. May I call this micro rules the real foundations
of OST?

Regards

Artur

Peggy Holman <peggy at opencirclecompany.com> wrote:

Such a rich discussion!

I want to introduce a couple themes that stand out for me as we continue to 
form the notions that describes self-organization in social systems.

For me, the practice of opening space brings consciousness to the 
self-organization that is evolution at work.  (...)

  _____  

Shape Yahoo! in your own image. Join
<http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48517/*http:/surveylink.yahoo.com/gmrs/yahoo_pan
el_invite.asp?a=7> our Network Research Panel today! * *
==========================================================
OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU ------------------------------ To subscribe,
unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of
oslist at listserv.boisestate.edu:
http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html To learn about
OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs: http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist

*
*
==========================================================
OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU
------------------------------
To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options,
view the archives of oslist at listserv.boisestate.edu:
http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html

To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs:
http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist

------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C7A20D.6F3705E0
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html>

<head>
<META HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type" CONTENT="text/html; charset=us-ascii">

<meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 10 (filtered)">

<style>
<!--
 /* Font Definitions */
 @font-face
	{font-family:Wingdings;
	panose-1:5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
	{font-family:Tahoma;
	panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
 /* Style Definitions */
 p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
	{margin:0in;
	margin-bottom:.0001pt;
	font-size:12.0pt;
	font-family:"Times New Roman";}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
	{color:blue;
	text-decoration:underline;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
	{color:blue;
	text-decoration:underline;}
p
	{margin-right:0in;
	margin-left:0in;
	font-size:12.0pt;
	font-family:"Times New Roman";}
p.Style1, li.Style1, div.Style1
	{margin:0in;
	margin-bottom:.0001pt;
	font-size:12.0pt;
	font-family:"Times New Roman";}
span.EmailStyle19
	{font-family:Arial;
	color:red;
	font-weight:normal;
	font-style:normal;
	text-decoration:none none;}
@page Section1
	{size:8.5in 11.0in;
	margin:1.0in 1.25in 1.0in 1.25in;}
div.Section1
	{page:Section1;}
-->
</style>

</head>

<body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=blue>

<div class=Section1>

Artur – great to see you here! I
could ask where you have been hiding, but I am afraid you might tell me. J

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=red face=Arial><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:red'> </span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=red face=Arial><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:red'>I’m curious why do you include the
Law of Two Feet under the heading of “micro-rule,” but not the Four
Principles?</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=red face=Arial><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:red'> </span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=red face=Arial><span style='font-size:
 12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:red'>Harrison</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=red face=Arial><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:red'> </span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=red face=Arial><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:red'> </span></font></p>

<div>

<p align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=2 color=red face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:red'>Harrison Owen</span></font></p>

<p align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=2 color=red face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:red'>7808 River Falls Drive</span></font></p>

<p align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=2 color=red face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:red'>Potomac,
Maryland   20854</span></font></p>

<p align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=2 color=red face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:red'>Phone </span></font><font size=2 color=red face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
 color:red'>301-365-2093</span></font></p>

<p align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=2 color=red face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:red'>Skype hhowen</span></font></p>

<p align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3 color=red face=Arial><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:red'>Open Space Training</span></font><font
color=red><span style='color:red'> <a href="http://www.openspaceworld.com/"><font
face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>www.openspaceworld.com</span></font></a>
</span></font></p>

<p align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3 color=red face=Arial><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:red'>Open Space Institute</span></font><font
color=red><span style='color:red'> <a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/"><font
face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>www.openspaceworld.org</span></font></a></span></font></p>

<p align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3 color=red face=Arial><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:red'>Personal website</span></font><font
color=red><span style='color:red'> <a href="http://www.ho-image.com/"><font
face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>www.ho-image.com</span></font></a> </span></font></p>

<p align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3 color=red face=Arial><span
 style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:red'>OSLIST</span></font><font
color=red face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial;color:red'>: To subscribe,
unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives Visit: </span></font><font
color=red><span style='color:red'><a
href="http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html"><font face=Arial><span
style='font-family:Arial'>www.listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html</span></font></a></span></font></p>

</div>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=red face=Arial><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:red'> </span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>-----Original Message-----<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>From:</span></b> OSLIST
[mailto:OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU] <b><span style='font-weight:bold'>On
Behalf Of </span></b>Artur Silva<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Tuesday, May 29, 2007 8:38
AM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: doing
self-organization - OST "foundations"</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> </span></font></p>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>[Very quickly with no time for
revision…]</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> </span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Interesting threat.</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> </span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

I also believe that
self-organization, in its relation with complex adaptive systems, is
fundamental to OST.

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> </span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>In voluntary emergent Systems there
are normally micro rules that allow for self organization to emerge at a macro
level.</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> </span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>So this thread can be a good way to
look for those micro rules.</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> </span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

When we ask "Why does OST
works?" there are a lot of micro rules that are "imposed" in OST
“by design”.

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> </span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>I would also agree that
"invitation" is one of those.</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> </span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Bur there are others that are so
evident that we don't think about them anymore when we refer to OST.</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> </span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Like diversity (the invitation being
sent to all the interested stakeholders).</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> </span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Like the circle in all types of
sessions (allowing for equality and for conections/relationships, etc)</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> </span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>The posting of themes (people
are again invited, but not forced)</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> </span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>The break out session procedures.</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> </span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>The law of two feet.</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> </span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Etc</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> </span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

What I would not consider as
"foundations of OST" (when we think at a micro level) are the so
called principles. If they exist at all, I think they are a macro effect of
what I am calling the foundations.

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> </span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

They occur (as many other
astonishing things) when some very easy and simple micro rules are followed.
May I call this micro rules the real foundations of OST?

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> </span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Regards</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> </span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Artur</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> </span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>   <br>
<br>
<b><i><span style='font-weight:bold;font-style:italic'>Peggy Holman
<peggy at opencirclecompany.com></span></i></b> wrote:</span></font></p>

</div>

</div>

<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 3.0pt;
margin-left:2.5pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>Such a rich discussion!<br>
<br>
I want to introduce a couple themes that stand out for me as we continue to <br>
form the notions that describes self-organization in social systems.<br>
<br>
For me, the practice of opening space brings consciousness to the <br>
self-organization that is evolution at work.  (...)</span></font></p>

</blockquote>

<p style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>  </span></font></p>

<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='margin-left:.5in;text-align:center'><font
size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>

<hr size=1 width="100%" align=center>

</span></font></div>

Shape Yahoo! in your own image. <a
href="http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48517/*http:/surveylink.yahoo.com/gmrs/yahoo_panel_invite.asp?a=7">Join
our Network Research Panel today!</a> * *
==========================================================
OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU ------------------------------ To subscribe,
unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of
oslist at listserv.boisestate.edu:
http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html To learn about
OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs: http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist

</div>

</body>

</html>
*
*
==========================================================
OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU
------------------------------
To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options,
view the archives of oslist at listserv.boisestate.edu:
http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html

To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs:
http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist

------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C7A20D.6F3705E0--