<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"><head><meta http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=us-ascii"><meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 12 (filtered medium)"><style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:"Cambria Math";
panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Calibri;
panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Tahoma;
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Consolas;
panose-1:2 11 6 9 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";
color:black;}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:blue;
text-decoration:underline;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:purple;
text-decoration:underline;}
span.EmailStyle17
{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D;}
.MsoChpDefault
{mso-style-type:export-only;
font-size:10.0pt;}
@page WordSection1
{size:8.5in 11.0in;
margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}
div.WordSection1
{page:WordSection1;}
--></style><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapedefaults v:ext="edit" spidmax="1026" />
</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapelayout v:ext="edit">
<o:idmap v:ext="edit" data="1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body bgcolor=white lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Harold, my friend! I don’t bite. Really! Conversation #2 is not only welcome, but essential. You may have heard me say something like, “Anybody with a good head and a good heart can do the job. And it may well take you a lifetime to learn how to do it really well.” I do think both are true. But I am not sure that the “content” of all that learning is fundamentally about “tradecraft” ... things to do when opening space. To be sure there are some necessary practicalities like: How much wall space do you need? Number of breakouts? Meals and such? But the critical part (for me at least) comes from a rather different realm. Dan raised the question – Is Open Space a spiritual practice? That has certainly been my experience and the learnings have been much more about Not Doing. For most of us it is really hard to let go of outcomes, being totally present and absolutely invisible, and all that stuff. I guess if I were to start doing training programs once again, the design might look something like Part I “Practicalities – room setup, harvesting, etc.” That would be the short part, then we would get down to the real work which might look something like a full day in silent meditation – Part II.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>So I definitely think Wikipedia could do it, but even that might be a bit of overkill. When it comes to Part II.....<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Harrison<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Harrison Owen<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>7808 River Falls Dr.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Potomac, MD 20854<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>USA<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>189 Beaucaire Ave. (summer)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Camden, Maine 04843<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Phone 301-365-2093<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>(summer) 207-763-3261<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><a href="www.openspaceworld.com%20"><span style='color:blue'>www.openspaceworld.com</span></a> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><a href="www.ho-image.com%20"><span style='color:blue'>www.ho-image.com</span></a> (Personal Website)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas;color:#1F497D'>To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of OSLIST Go to:<a href="http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org"><span style='color:blue'>http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext'> oslist-bounces@lists.openspacetech.org [mailto:oslist-bounces@lists.openspacetech.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Harold Shinsato<br><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, October 24, 2013 8:53 PM<br><b>To:</b> OSLIST<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [OSList] OST / Gaming<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>"<span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>our current discussion of Gaming (Game theory, Finite and Infinite Games, etc). [...] I still don’t understand how it advances our understanding of our world as encountered in Open Space, and more specifically, how it enables me to more effectively navigate that world for myself, and with others, who may choose the journey."<br><br>There are two beautifully contradictory answers to this:<br><br>1) It makes no difference.<br>2) It makes worlds and worlds of difference.<br><br>I experience much truth in both answers. And looking at those "answers" as conversations, there are many more questions in each answer. Are both conversations truly welcome?<br><br>Let me speak to conversation one. People encountering Open Space for the first time don't need more than those 10-15 minutes to be invited to play in it. In fact, adding much more to those minutes usually starts crowding out the voice of the new person being invited in.<br><br>What about people wanting to facilitate Open Space? There are multiple books. Multiple trainings. Does one really need more than the description of OST on wikipedia to do it? If that becomes an excuse for not setting up an Open Space that's ready to happen - then I say the answer is No No No! You're ready, you can do it, you can learn as you go.<br><br>I'm sure I could go on and on with scenarios where more than the basics is not helpful.<br><br>That said, I'm still wishing there were more space for conversation 2. Hey, maybe I'm hallucinating, but it's persistently feeling like the people in conversation one are saying "You shouldn't be in conversation two". Psychological safety? I'm not feeling it.<br><br> Harold<br><br></span><br>On 10/24/13 2:38 PM, Harrison Owen wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Anne – I noticed your pebble! And I think you are dead right. Magnificent, complex, living systems simply defy capture in a single frame. It isn’t their problem, it is the problem of our language... always too small to do the job. But I don’t see that as a “problem” either. For me it is really an opportunity and an invitation to keep framing and reframing. It just gets richer, and the conversation continues. I think we only get in trouble when we (whoever “we” is) get stuck in the “one right way” syndrome. Even controversy is valuable, if only because it offers the chance to refine our pictures. And best of all, allows us to hold several pictures at the same time... especially when they are contradictory. Sort of the Wave and Particle kind of thing. It is always tempting to ask which one is the right one? And the answer is clearly, Both. It just depends on how you are looking at things. Marvelous!</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>All that said, I do have to confess to being a died in the wool, American Pragmatist. I can usually always see the value of somebody else’s picture, but then I have to ask – What does it do? What does it do to enable me to perform some needed function, understand my current reality with greater clarity, get on with the business, so to speak. I also find it useful to combine pragmatism with a good dose of Occam’s Razor – AKA The Law of Parsimony. There are lots of ways of describing the “law” – but it could be, “How can you say the most with the fewest words?” </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I suppose that is just academic obfuscation... but it does have a lot to do with our current discussion of Gaming (Game theory, Finite and Infinite Games, etc). I know a fair amount of the literature, have used the approach in multiple situations creating policy and practice... and I still don’t understand how it advances our understanding of our world as encountered in Open Space, and more specifically, how it enables me to more effectively navigate that world for myself, and with others, who may choose the journey. Doubtless this is a case of the hardening of the senile neuro-pathways, but that is where I is.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Thanks for the Pebble!</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Harrison</span><o:p></o:p></p></blockquote><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>-- <br>Harold Shinsato<br><a href="mailto:harold@shinsato.com">harold@shinsato.com</a><br><a href="http://shinsato.com">http://shinsato.com</a><br>twitter: <a href="http://twitter.com/hajush">@hajush</a><o:p></o:p></p></div></div></body></html>