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Michael,<br>
<br>
Thanks for your reply; I like this conversation. <br>
<br>
My current beliefs summarized:<br>
<br>
1/ The culture of the org is a game. It is goal-seeking, it has
rules. It delivers feedback. It is opt-in, because you can quit the
org. (See <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.TheCultureGame.com">www.TheCultureGame.com</a>)<br>
<br>
2/ OST is a pre-fabricated meeting format with excellent game
properties. It is well formed. It is optimized on manifesting
up-spirit, as described in the SPIRIT book. Spirit is a topic beyond
the scope of this thread<br>
<br>
3/ Leaders choose to play OST. Or not. If the Facilitator stays true
to OST, the leader opts-in-or-opts-out to occupying the Sponsor role
and actually going all the way with OST (self-selection, all issues
on the table). This amounts to opting-in to play the OST game.<br>
<br>
4/ Org culture is a game. Games in orgs are nested. Thus a meeting
is a small finite game bounded by time and space inside the org's
wider culture-game-space. Orgs contain collections of meetings. As a
general rule, most meetings reflect the containing ambient culture;
authentic OST meetings are a notable exception. An OST meeting has
at least the potential to change the culture in the
culture-game-space of the org. <br>
<br>
5/ There is no 'real' and 'game' distinction. All real work is a
game. The real work and the meeting are one and the same: games.<br>
<br>
However, the game of the org (per McGonigal) is not well formed.
Goals are unclear. Rules are not uniformly applied. Self-selection
gets "managed". Spirit gets dampened. Meetings are not opt-in.
Disengagement becomes a rational response and a grave consequence of
the poorly formed game. Etc. OST has none of these warts. It's a
good game, one that's fun to play.<br>
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.gaminghappiness.com">www.gaminghappiness.com</a><br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 10/6/13 2:28 PM, Michael Herman
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAD8j=QFciBSnbdwagbPc_uhcFZ7r2+E9Jo4JnFgdL8Gx+aGNZw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">what your quoting suggests to me, dan, is a
distinction akin to what i've already shared about
tools/techniques versus practice.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>in another message you've suggested rules, feedback etc,
and defined ost as a game. what i hear harrison saying in the
quoting here, though, suggests that organization is the game.
<br>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
My current belief: The culture of the org is a game. It is
goal-seeking, it has rules. It delivers feedback. It is opt-in,
because you can quit the org. (See <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.TheCultureGame.com">www.TheCultureGame.com</a>)<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAD8j=QFciBSnbdwagbPc_uhcFZ7r2+E9Jo4JnFgdL8Gx+aGNZw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>ost is a strategy, a style of play, a gambit, or something
inside of that game. <br>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
My current belief: It's a meeting. Good meetings are well-formed
games according the McGonigal definition found inside the book
REALITY IS BROKEN, page 22. <br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAD8j=QFciBSnbdwagbPc_uhcFZ7r2+E9Jo4JnFgdL8Gx+aGNZw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>it's a way we choose to play. (when i go look it up to be
sure, i think when you're calling ost a game, i think gambit
might be the better word.)</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
My current belief: Yes, leaders opt-in to occupying the Sponsor role
and actually going all the way with OST (self-selection, all issues
on the table)<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAD8j=QFciBSnbdwagbPc_uhcFZ7r2+E9Jo4JnFgdL8Gx+aGNZw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div><br>
</div>
<div>this helps explain, at least to myself, why calling open
space itself a game seems too small. it seems to remove open
space from the larger context, and in doing so, the practice
loses it's reason for being. it never exists on its own, for
it's own sake... always we "do it" for some purpose. the
chasing of that purpose is the game. if we make open space a
game, we give up our license to comment on the larger game
that is organization, software development, or whatever. in
other words, my sense is that if the languaging of these
things makes ost a "game" and organization/software/whatever
is "real" -- then ost becomes significantly limited in what it
can do to change what i see as the real game, the bigger field
of play.</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
My current belief: Games in orgs are nested. Thus a meeting is a
small finite game bounded by time and space inside the org's wider
culture-game-space. As a general rule, most meetings reflect the
containing ambient culture, authentic OST meetings are a notable
exception.<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAD8j=QFciBSnbdwagbPc_uhcFZ7r2+E9Jo4JnFgdL8Gx+aGNZw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div> </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>i don't know this for sure, but this is my hunch. it also
may be that this story works better in software circles, where
the actual work, much of it done by people glued to computer
screens, looks more like some kinds of gaming. this context
would make the split between real work and gaming less
pronounced. <br>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
My current belief: All real work is a game. However, the game is not
well formed. Goals are often unclear. Rules are not uniformly
applied to all. Self-selection gets "managed". Etc. <br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAD8j=QFciBSnbdwagbPc_uhcFZ7r2+E9Jo4JnFgdL8Gx+aGNZw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div><br>
</div>
<div>i'm all for it, if and wherever it works. and my guess is
that it doesn't translate immediately, cleanly, and
effectively to all kinds of work. but then again, almost
story does translate easily and effectively to every/any
context. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>m</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
<div> <br>
--<br>
<br>
Michael Herman<br>
Michael Herman Associates<br>
312-280-7838 (mobile)<br>
<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://MichaelHerman.com"
target="_blank">http://MichaelHerman.com</a><br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://OpenSpaceWorld.org"
target="_blank">http://OpenSpaceWorld.org</a><br>
<br>
</div>
<br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Sun, Oct 6, 2013 at 10:44 AM, Skye
Hirst <span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:skyeh@autognomics.org" target="_blank">skyeh@autognomics.org</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>I guess I want to play in this "game". Feedback
implies mechanistic processes that have been identified
through cause and effect responses. This is where we
get into trouble. Life is not machine like, in any
way. It is complex and not complicated as a set of
gears and cogs can become if there are too many trying
to interact. However processes of living require new
metaphors to capture or even point to the "game" of
living process where each entity and combination of
entities initiate to form a group, organization or
society and have formed to "experience satisfaction" or
find effective actions separately and together. The
constraints emerge from what the individuals and the
collective discover as useful temporary rules of the
moment - they can take habit if they are useful beyond
the moment. Some where in the process someone decides
to "name" the rule, the process and everyone nods in
agreement to call what they have shared in common by
"that word" (i.e. jargon) Then someone else comes along
who perhaps was not in the experience and take up the
name and they pass it along as the "rule" that must be
the container for that process and try to create the
same process starting with the rule instead of the
initiating impulse to come together.<br>
<br>
</div>
Well I think you can see an ephemeral organic process that
is ever changing gets bogged down with words, the names
and with labels, however useful they may be for a bit.
GAme on, as they say, yet, all I'm suggesting is that
we stop trying to name, and control with naming a process
beyond anything but pointers we can use to share a common
experience - each of us forming it each time uniquely with
both particular and universal operatives. Unique to the
entities in the forming circle, the space time event
forming the circle and so on and so on<br>
<br>
<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div>
<div class="h5">On Sun, Oct 6, 2013 at 10:41 AM,
Daniel Mezick <span dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:dan@newtechusa.net" target="_blank">dan@newtechusa.net</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
</div>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<div class="h5">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> Hi Harold,<br>
<br>
In THE CULTURE GAME book I make the
radical/heretical claim that culture is a
game...and every meeting...a game.... and in
fact every interaction... is a game. <br>
<br>
In the book there are examples that support the
idea that all meetings are games. <br>
<br>
According to this theory, if OST is a type of
meeting, then OST is a type of game. <br>
Games have: Goal, Rules, Feedback mechanisms,
Opt-in Participation.<br>
<br>
The OST Game:<br>
<br>
The Goal:<br>
Explore the Theme-Question.<br>
<br>
The Rules:<br>
1 Law, 4/5 Principles, some defined Roles, a few
other suggestions. A supporting slogan...<br>
<br>
The Feedback Mechanics:<br>
Continuous, rich feedback via all of the senses,
in real time for each individual and
group-as-a-whole.<br>
<br>
Opt-In Participation:<br>
YES<br>
<br>
By these measures, OST is a beautifully designed
meeting-game.<br>
<br>
<br>
Here is a specific quote from your message,
below:<br>
<br>
"But I'd never heard anyone describe Open Space
Technology as a beautifully designed game
before."
<div><br>
The reality is that Harrison mentions the word
[game] when discussing High Play & High
Learning as it pertains to self-organizing
social systems... it shows up in the book Wave
Rider. OST encourages a social system to reach
higher levels of self-organization...Hmmm.<br>
<br>
Here is the quote (emphasis added...):<br>
<br>
"...High play is the antidote to dogmatic
thinking & therefore an essential
companion to High Learning. It is also fun. In
'X" Company, PLAY is strictly prohibited, for
after all there is work to be done and it is
always very serious. Even worse, PLAY, almost
by definition, is out of control- which is
what makes if fun. Can you imagine anything
worse than PLAYING A GAME where the results
are already known in advance? Boring! "<br>
-H.O., Wave Rider, page 132<br>
<br>
<br>
On 9/4/13 6:23 PM, Harold Shinsato wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>Dan,<br>
<br>
Thank you for forwarding that interview.
I've worked with your interviewer Amr
Elssamadisy before in Dr. Christopher
Avery's "Leadership Gift" program. Great to
hear his voice. Thought he did a great job
bringing forward your insights.<br>
<br>
It's hard for me to express how deeply your
thinking aligned with what I see as the
essence of Open Space, and what I feel
emerging in my own psyche and that in the
collective when we spoke and I got to be
present at your session in Nashville at
Agile 2013 last month. I continue to find
your material to be a critical piece in
helping bridge the Open Space and Agile
communities - something Peggy Holman called
"Sister Communities" at the World Open Space
on Open Space in St. Petersburg back in May.<br>
<br>
I'd heard your thinking before and it
continues to astound me the relevance and
power in getting these two communities to
work together.<br>
<br>
Open Space truly is the "secret sauce"
making possible successful Agile adoptions.
The science behind this awareness goes deep.
The timing of it feels like perfection. You
seem to be getting just the right audiences
to engage with this idea. And what you
posted earlier in terms of a framework for
adoption involving interspersed Open Space
events to help promote agency and engagement
- very exciting. Very simple. Truly elegant.
And phrased in a way the holders of the
bottom line can "get it".<br>
<br>
What's new about your stuff?<br>
<br>
Perhaps it's been mentioned before - but
here are some points I find most critical.<br>
<br>
1) The Mandate. Perhaps Open Space
Technology came out of Organizational
Development (and Organizational
Transformation). But most attempts to
transform the organization that I've seen
have been "rolled out". Kind of like a steam
roller. It's definitely mandated. You went
into great depth in your Agile 2013
presentation how Mandated Agile goes
fundamentally against the values and
principles in the Agile Manifesto. Open
Space can help us bring back the original
thinking of the signatories of the Agile
Manifesto.<br>
<br>
2) Games and engagement. Jane McGonigal's
book "Reality Is Broken", and the whole
arena of Gamification, has become a focal
point of driving home ideas from positive
psychology, and is also driving many huge
wheels of industry (and dollars). Because
getting people excited about using your
products is important. Getting employees
excited about contributing to your products
- also critical. But I'd never heard anyone
describe Open Space Technology as a
beautifully designed game before. This
perception I think plays directly with the
TOOL versus PHILOSOPHY debate in our
community.<br>
<br>
3) Agency. This might have been a
significant idea as well in Paolo Friere's
book - "The Pedagogy of the Oppressed".
Without people feeling like they have some
say in how they apply their blood, sweat,
and tears - engagement is not going to
happen. Open Space is a critical way to
nurture agency in people.<br>
<br>
I'm so thankful that you've started posting
on the OSList and I look forward to how
things unfold. From what I see you saying,
and how I see people are hearing you, it
seems as if we're on target for a much more
explicit chapter in the relationship between
the Agile and Open Space "sister
communities".<br>
<br>
Thanks!<br>
Harold<br>
<br>
<br>
On 9/4/13 2:37 PM, Daniel Mezick wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"> Here's a 16-minute
video that explains the crisis of
disengagement in Agile adoptions, and how
the time to act was yesterday, and how Open
Space can help...<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.infoq.com/interviews/dan-mezick-qcon-new-york-2013"
target="_blank">http://www.infoq.com/interviews/dan-mezick-qcon-new-york-2013</a><br>
<br>
<div>-- <br>
<p>Daniel Mezick, President</p>
<p>New Technology Solutions Inc.</p>
<p><br>
<br>
</p>
<div>-- <br>
Harold Shinsato<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:harold@shinsato.com"
target="_blank">harold@shinsato.com</a><br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://shinsato.com"
target="_blank">http://shinsato.com</a><br>
twitter: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://twitter.com/hajush"
target="_blank">@hajush</a></div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<br>
<div>-- <br>
<p>Daniel Mezick, President</p>
<p>New Technology Solutions Inc.</p>
<p><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="tel:%28203%29%20915%207248"
value="+12039157248" target="_blank">(203)
915 7248</a> (cell)</p>
<p><span><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://newtechusa.net/dan-mezick/"
target="_blank">Bio</a></span><span>. <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://newtechusa.net/blog/"
target="_blank"><span>Blog</span></a>. <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://twitter.com/#%21/danmezick/"
target="_blank"><span>Twitter</span></a>.<span> </span></span></p>
<p><span>Examine my new book:<span> </span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://newtechusa.net/about/the-culture-game-book/"
target="_blank"><span>The Culture Game </span></a></span><span>:
Tools for the Agile Manager</span><span>.</span></p>
<p>Explore Agile Team <a
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target="_blank"><span>Training</span></a>
and <a moz-do-not-send="true"
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target="_blank"><span>Coaching.</span></a></p>
<p>Explore the <a moz-do-not-send="true"
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-- <br>
<div dir="ltr">
<div>
<div><b>Skye Hirst, PhD</b><br>
</div>
President - The Autognomics Institute<br>
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<div><i>Conversations in the Ways of Life-itself</i><br>
</div>
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