<div dir="ltr">Very interesting discussion. Meanwhile, in terms of OST economics, the economics profession and all the adherents have so much power since they choose what ideas/explanations, etc. get proffered for the worlds' events. Many people who come into an Open Space event will carry those beliefs, which are themselves a mere subset and selection of possibilities heavily influenced by power preservation inherent in institutions. <br>
<br>Many of the most influential people in the world operate by these beliefs which say justify austerity because of public debts (and despite destruction of social fabric, even rising suicide rates), public debts themselves (which are not a foregone conclusion in the grand scheme of things), or even the very concept of interest-bearing money, which is itself laden with ecological, power, and social hierarchy implications all by itself. And, powerful funding sources ensure new generations get taught these ideas at universities and secondary schools so that they are not even any longer debatable. <br>
<br>There are so many assumptions not even questioned in our current world because of this hegemony. <br></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Oct 2, 2013 at 11:40 AM, Diane Gibeault <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:diane.gibeault@rogers.com" target="_blank">diane.gibeault@rogers.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div style="font-size:10pt;font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><div><span>I think the idea is not CEOs giving up power but getting more effective power, differently. </span></div>
<div style="font-style:normal;font-size:13px;background-color:transparent;font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span><br></span></div><div style="font-style:normal;font-size:13px;background-color:transparent;font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">
<span>The CEOs are invited to expand their definition of power to include shared leadership, a more open way of working with all elements of the organization... </span></div><div style="font-style:normal;font-size:13px;background-color:transparent;font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">
<span>Harrison's description of the power that emerges through self-organization captures
well this different paradigm of power.</span></div><div style="font-style:normal;font-size:13px;background-color:transparent;font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span><br></span></div><div style="font-style:normal;font-size:13px;background-color:transparent;font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">
<span>Diane</span></div><div></div><div> </div><div><div style="line-height:1.22;font-variant:normal;font-size:13px;font-style:normal;display:block;margin:2px 0px 0px 2px;font-family:arial,helvetica,clean,sans-serif;font-weight:normal;padding:0px">
<div><div class="MsoNormal"><div style="line-height:1.22;font-variant:normal;font-size:13px;font-style:normal;display:block;margin:2px 0px 0px 2px;font-family:arial,helvetica,clean,sans-serif;font-weight:normal;padding:0px">
<div><div class="MsoNormal" style="line-height:normal;font-size:16px;font-family:Times"><br></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><div><blockquote style="border-left:2px solid rgb(16,16,255);margin-left:5px;margin-top:5px;padding-left:5px">
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:10pt"> <div style="font-family:'times new roman','new york',times,serif;font-size:12pt"> <div dir="ltr"> <hr size="1"> <font face="Arial"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold">From:</span></b> Bui Petersen <<a href="mailto:bui.petersen@gmail.com" target="_blank">bui.petersen@gmail.com</a>><div class="im">
<br> <b><span style="font-weight:bold">To:</span></b> World wide Open Space Technology email list <<a href="mailto:oslist@lists.openspacetech.org" target="_blank">oslist@lists.openspacetech.org</a>> <br> </div><b><span style="font-weight:bold">Sent:</span></b> Wednesday, October 2, 2013 10:52:41 AM<div class="im">
<br> <b><span style="font-weight:bold">Subject:</span></b> Re: [OSList] Open Space Economics? Be Prepared to be Surprised!<br> </div></font> </div>
<div><br><div><div class="h5"><div><div>
Maybe "circumventing" is the wrong word. But for me the issue of
power is central. In order for OST to work, the "CEO" has to
temporarily give up some of her/his power (both procedural and
positional).<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
I'm quite serious about this, and OST (and other group processes)
may become part of my academic research (I just started on an PhD in
Management). Maybe my contribution will be to help make the field of
Management become more open to self-organization. :)<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
Maybe you'll all hear back from me in a few years. :)<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
Bui<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
<div><div>On 02/10/2013 1:04 AM, Michael Herman
wrote:<br clear="none">
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">I can't ever remember "attempting to circumvent
power dynamics," Bui. While it's quite common when people talk
about sitting in a circle they say things like, "...the circle
makes everyone equal." I always disagree. The circle gives
everyone equal access to all the others in the circle, the
markers and paper and microphone at the center, and the bulletin
board gives everyone the same access to all of the info that is
generated. It doesn't make them equal, the ceo has an entirely
different set of skills, resources, experiences, concerns than
the new intern. But as a facilitator, I give everyone the same
job: learn and contribute as much as you can, from wherever you
are, with whatever you have at your disposal. serve the common
purpose.
<div>
<br clear="none">
</div>
<div>none of this attempts or requires any circumventing. i
think ost works in spite of whatever the power structure might
be, once people show up. maybe the invitation tweaks the
power structure -- but if the invite comes from the top, then
it's the top giving power away -- hardly a circumvention, and
certainly not the facilitator attempting. if the invite
bubbles up from somewhere below, then it's the lower ranks
claiming power for themselves. so i think any shifting of
power arises because invitation exists as an option, not
because anything we do in the process of 'opening space.' i
think ost is just one way of pointing out that invitation is
possible and the ost story is pretty much the same in all
kinds of different "power" distributions. </div>
<div><br clear="none">
</div>
<div>or maybe i just don't understand. what do you do to notice
and recognize power imbalances? and how have you seen this
improve the ost experience for people? </div>
<div><br clear="none">
</div>
<div>m</div>
<div>
<br clear="none">
</div>
</div>
<div><br clear="all">
<div> <br clear="none">
--<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
Michael Herman<br clear="none">
Michael Herman Associates<br clear="none">
<a href="tel:312-280-7838" value="+13122807838" target="_blank">312-280-7838</a> (mobile)<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" href="http://michaelherman.com/" target="_blank">http://MichaelHerman.com</a><br clear="none">
<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" href="http://openspaceworld.org/" target="_blank">http://OpenSpaceWorld.org</a><br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
</div>
<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
<div>On Tue, Oct 1, 2013 at 5:06 PM, Bui
Petersen <span dir="ltr"><<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" href="mailto:bui.petersen@gmail.com" target="_blank">bui.petersen@gmail.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br clear="none">
<blockquote style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div> Michael, I guess
we'll have to disagree. I see OST's temporal attempt at
circumventing power dynamics (e.g through the the
empowered of the the law of two feet) as one of the
beauties of the process. <br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
One of the reasons that the liberal view of market
economics is problematic is that it doesn't account for
power imbalances. While you can't take away all structural
power, I think the OST experience can be enhanced by at
least some awareness and recognition of such powers.<span><font color="#888888"><br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
Bui</font></span>
<div>
<div><br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
<div>On 30/09/2013 10:56 PM, Michael Herman wrote:<br clear="none">
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">i don't think ost is trying to "take
away structural power," bui -- not even
temporarily. i think it's more about
acknowledging the distribution of knowledge and
choice (power) that already exists. the law of
two feet isn't something special we enact at the
start of an event, it's something we just notice
and point out, for instance.
<div> <br clear="none">
</div>
<div>m </div>
</div>
<div><br clear="all">
<div> <br clear="none">
--<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
Michael Herman<br clear="none">
Michael Herman Associates<br clear="none">
<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect">312-280-7838</a> (mobile)<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" href="http://michaelherman.com/" target="_blank">http://MichaelHerman.com</a><br clear="none">
<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" href="http://openspaceworld.org/" target="_blank">http://OpenSpaceWorld.org</a><br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
</div>
<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
<div>On Mon, Sep 30, 2013 at
10:21 AM, Bui Petersen <span dir="ltr"><<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" href="mailto:bui.petersen@gmail.com" target="_blank">bui.petersen@gmail.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br clear="none">
<blockquote style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div>
Interesting discussion. When I have
described OST, some people have been
skeptical as it to them has has sounded to
"neo-liberal" and not taking power balances
enough into consideration. Obviously what
the "structure" of OST is trying to do is to
take away structural power temporarily. But
some people are still skeptical about OST's
potential to do this. My own take is that
OST does not always fully succeed in this
regard. <br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
Still it is very interesting theoretically.
Both there is a lot of other (than
economics) theoretical perspectives that
better deal with power.<span><font color="#888888"><br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
Bui</font></span>
<div>
<div><br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
<div>On 26/09/2013 5:33 PM, Michael
Herman wrote:<br clear="none">
</div>
</div>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<div>I share your concerns, Jeff, but
found this piece to be mostly not
about politics. And where he comments
on current views and policy, I was
less bothered by what he was saying
than by my tendency to agree in many
cases. But mostly this is interesting
and useful totally separate from his
politics, I think. <br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
On Thursday, September 26, 2013, Jeff
Aitken wrote:<br clear="none">
<blockquote style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div>thanks Michael! </div>
<div> </div>
<div>It's unfortunate that I have a
lingering dislike for Mr. Gilder,
who was famous for awhile around
1981 when the Reagan
administration rolled out its
economic agenda, and his work was
considered one of its intellectual
pillars.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>Twas a long time ago, and no
doubt the man remains a hard
thinker and clear writer, perhaps
with more heart than I experienced
back then.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>With that caveat, I'll dig into
this when I have a chance. Thanks
for sharing.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>Jeff</div>
<div>San Francisco<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
</div>
<div>On Thu, Sep
26, 2013 at 12:25 PM, Michael
Herman <span dir="ltr"><<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect">michael@michaelherman.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br clear="none">
<blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT:#ccc 1px solid;MARGIN:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;PADDING-LEFT:1ex">
<div title="Page 3">
<div>
<div>
<div title="Page 1">
<div>
<div>
<div><font face="Calibri" size="3">Here's
a long one,
friends… But
maybe an
important one.</font></div>
<div><font face="Calibri" size="3">What
follows is an
excerpt from a
markets
newsletter I've
read for maybe
10 years by a
financial expert
and best-selling
author Named
John Mauldin.
He describes
and then shares
an article by a
guy named George
Gilder, Who
seems to have
been writing
"important"
books for at
least a few
decades. </font></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br clear="none">
<br clear="none">
-- <br clear="none">
Michael Herman<br clear="none">
MichaelHerman.com<br clear="none">
<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect">(312)
280-7838</a>
<div>Sent from my iPhone<br clear="none">
</div>
<br clear="none">
<fieldset></fieldset>
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</div>
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