"It is important to strike a balance between what the client wants and what will work to get them where they hope to go."<br><br>Wait, you mean they're different? (just joking)<br><br>-Steve<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">
On Wed, Jul 1, 2009 at 8:49 AM, Lucy Garrick - NorthShore Group <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:lgarrick@northshoregroup.net">lgarrick@northshoregroup.net</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
<div style="">Hi Suzanne,<div><br></div><div>I understand how you feel. Many of your questions are as much about consulting (a practice) as they are about OS (an intervention methodology). When I first began consulting on my own I had consulted with some companies that used more of what consultant think of as the "expert" model of consulting. Excuse me if this is old info, but are you familiar with Edgar Schein's book, "Process Consultation Revisited"? Also Peter Block's "Flawless Consulting" is another good resource on process consultation. It is important to strike a balance between what the client wants and what will work to get them where they hope to go. </div>
<div><br></div><div>Best, Lucy Garrick</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><div><span style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verdana; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;"><div style="">
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<div><div><div>NorthShore Group</div><div>Organization Strategy, Planning and Leadership Consulting</div><div>Professional Coaching</div><div><a href="http://www.northshoregroup.net" target="_blank">http://www.northshoregroup.net</a><a href="http://northshoregroup.net/blog/index.html" target="_blank"></a></div>
<div>Blog: <a href="http://northshoregroup.net/blog/index.html" target="_blank"> Global Outlook from the NorthShore</a></div><div>Phone: +1*206-335-5635</div><div>Time Zone: Seattle, WA USA Pacific Standard (PST)</div></div>
</div></div></span></div></span></div></span></div></span></div></span></div></span></div></span></div></span></div></span><br></div></span><br></div></span><br></div></span><br> </div><br><div><div>On Jul 1, 2009, at 3:55 AM, Suzanne Daigle wrote:</div>
<br><blockquote type="cite"><span style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verdana; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;"><div>
<p style="margin: 0in 0in 10pt; line-height: 115%; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,sans-serif;">(warning very long...)<br></p><p style="margin: 0in 0in 10pt; line-height: 115%; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,sans-serif;">
As I follow and reflect on the discussion about visual protocol and offering visual results from an Open Space experience and then think about how we connect benefits of self-organizing to a client’s desired outcome, so many questions surface for me.<span> </span></p>
<p style="margin: 0in 0in 10pt; line-height: 115%; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,sans-serif;">How can we honor a client’s desired outcome which assumes predictability and control when Open Space invites something quite different?<span> <span> </span></span>With my limited experience with Open Space (I’ve only done two as an unpaid volunteer) and a long corporate career, my gut tells me that the Open Space way of lighting up passion and responsibility in individuals and collectives will lead to results that far exceed what a client could initially expect.<span> <span> </span></span>I know because all my life, I’ve seen how much gets accomplished when people are passionate about what they do.<span> </span><span> </span>Open Space is all about that. Many clients want a clear-cut route to improved results, better service, higher quality, etc.<span> <span> </span></span>This we cannot promise.<span> </span><span> </span>Rather, OS is a journey, a new way of doing which means undoing what didn’t work, and seeing what we don’t’ want to see to create what we can’t know.</p>
<p style="margin: 0in 0in 10pt; line-height: 115%; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,sans-serif;">How can we effectively convey to a client the importance of gut feel and intuition, inviting them to an experience that they must “feel” and not just “think”? The dilemma is that you cannot know Open Space until you’ve done Open Space and not just once.<span> <span> </span></span>How can you describe what get’s ignited in people when they get to choose (Law of Two Feet), feel Equal and live/work according to principles (4 OS principles) – something that makes so much sense but that is so different than what our current hierarchical world dictates?<span> </span></p>
<p style="margin: 0in 0in 10pt; line-height: 115%; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,sans-serif;">Once people are activated in an Open Space way, I think it ignites a longing that is in each of us and the difficulty is that you just don’t want to go back to the old way. How then do we blend traditional and self-organizing?</p>
<p style="margin: 0in 0in 10pt; line-height: 115%; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,sans-serif;">I struggle with these questions and as I embark on this wild ride of OS, I imagine myself building trust at the beginning of my relationship with clients talking about the issues that they care about and that they know: their business.<span> <span> </span></span>Hopefully by connecting and being honest, I will establish enough trust so that they will want to try this new way, knowing deep inside them that the old ways aren’t working any more.<span> <span> </span></span>It’s about finding the courage of our voice and actions, doing this together in a supportive way.</p>
<p style="margin: 0in 0in 10pt; line-height: 115%; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,sans-serif;">Knowing that we cannot immediately and fully internalize all that OS represents, I then struggle with how we can optimize and capture what Open Space does inside you.<span> <span> </span></span>What I did with incredible help from Michele Young, who assisted me on the two Open Spaces that I facilitated, was create a visual show that not only tried to capture in its authenticity what happened there but also tried to convey the spirit of the invitation and preparation and the OS concepts and themes of this new way of being so that people through pictures can remember what it “felt” like to be part of this.<span> <span> </span></span>I questioned myself in doing so wondering if this went against the principles of self-organizing, equality, and the self-effacing role of a facilitator. Then I told myself: heck…I’m doing it anyway as a gift.</p>
<p style="margin: 0in 0in 10pt; line-height: 115%; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,sans-serif;"> <span style="font-size: 10pt; line-height: 115%; font-family: 'Comic Sans MS'; color: rgb(250, 0, 0);">IONS Conference Open Space in Tucson<br>
</span><u><span style="font-size: 10.5pt; line-height: 115%; font-family: 'Comic Sans MS'; color: blue;"><a href="http://www.authorstream.com/Presentation/daigle_Suzanne-208049-ions-away-presentation-open-space-spiritual-inspirational-ppt-powerpoint/" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://www.authorstream.com/Presentation/daigle_Suzanne-208049-ions-away-presentation-open-space-spiritual-inspirational-ppt-powerpoint/</a></span></u><span style="font-size: 10.5pt; line-height: 115%; font-family: 'Comic Sans MS';"><span> </span> </span></p>
<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Jun 30, 2009 at 8:35 AM, Harrison Owen<span> </span><span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:hhowen@verizon.net" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">hhowen@verizon.net</a>></span><span> </span>wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"><div link="blue" vlink="purple" lang="EN-US"><div><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Thanks Michael -- I think<span> </span></span></font><font face="Wingdings"><span style="font-family: Wingdings;">J</span></font></p>
<div><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br></div><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Harrison</span></font></p><div><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br>
</div><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Harrison Owen</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">189 Beaucaire Ave</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Camden</span></font>, ME 04843</p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">207-763-3261 (Summer)</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">301-365-2093 (Winter)</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Website<span> </span><a href="http://www.openspaceworld.com" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">www.openspaceworld.com</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Personal Website<span> </span><a href="http://www.ho-image.com" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">www.ho-image.com</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">OSLIST</span></font><span> </span>To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options<span> </span><a href="http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html</a></p>
<div><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br></div><div><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br></div><div><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br>
</div><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">-----Original Message-----<br>From: OSLIST [mailto:<a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a>] On Behalf Of Michael M Pannwitz<br>
Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 7:46 AM<br>To:<span> </span><a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a><br>Subject: Re: AW: How can we foster sustainable outcomes?</span></font></p>
<div><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br></div><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Liebe Catherine,</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">ich hab zu Deiner Frage schon mal in dieser Liste auf Englisch</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">geschrieben, aber hier kommts nochmal auf deutsch (ich fänds super,</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">wenns auch noch jemand, der es auf französisch und italienisch und</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Latein probiert, aufschreibt, damit es sich in der ganzen Schweiz</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">verbreiten kann):</span></font></p>
<div><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br></div><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Mich</span></font><span> </span>interessieren Nachhaltigkeit oder nachhaltige Ergebnisse in meiner</p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Rolle als Begleiter überhaupt nicht.</span></font></p><div><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br></div><p>
<font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Wenn der Veranstalter allerdings sowas will, nehm ich ihm ja auch in</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">keiner Weise krumm, dann sage ich ihm, was er tun kann, damit die</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Wahrscheinlichkeit von nachhaltiger Umsetzung von Verabredungen zu</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Vorhaben steigt und welcher Aufwand von Veranstaltern dazu mit ziemlich</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">gutem Erfolg dafür betrieben worden ist.</span></font></p>
<div><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br></div><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Gleich zu Anfang möchte ich Dir aber verraten, dass die Form der</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Dokumentation dabei eine eher untergeordnete Rolle spielt (hierzu hatte</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">ich auch auf die Berichte von John Engle verwiesen aus Situationen, in</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">denen es kein Papier, keine Stifte gibt und in denen viele der</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Teilnehmenden auch nicht lesen oder schreiben können).</span></font></p>
<div><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br></div><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Also hier meine Hinweise an den Veranstalter:</span></font></p>
<div><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br></div><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">1. Ein Vorbereitungstreffen mit einer Gruppe, die in etwa die erwartete</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Teilnehmerschaft abbildet, also das ganze System, wie es sich zu diesem</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Zeitpunkt für ihn darstellt, zusammenbringen. Sie / er gehört dazu.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Optimal ist, wenn diese Gruppe authorisiert ist mit ihr / ihm gemeinsame</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">alles zu entscheiden: Thema, Einzuladende, Einladung, Organisation, etc.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Ich biete ihm die Begleitung des in der Regel 3,5stündigen Treffens an.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">2. Eine Einladung, in der nicht nur zu der Veranstaltung eingeladen</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">wird, sondern auch schon zu dem 8 bis 12 Wochen später stattfindendem</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">"Nächsten Treffen", bei dem die Vorhaben, die in der Handlungsplanung am</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Ende der OST Veranstaltung verabredet wurden, angeschaut werden...wo</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">sind wir jetzt?, gibts neue Vorhaben?, wie gehts weiter?...plus mögliche</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">weitere "Nächste Treffen".</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">3. Ein Verfahren, in dem so gut wie es irgendwie möglich ist</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">sichergestellt wird, dass all diejenigen auf jeweils spezifische Art und</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Weise vom Veranstalter und Mitgliedern der Vorbereitungsgruppe</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">eingeladen werden, die dafür notwendig erscheinen, die Erwartungen unter</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">der gewählten Überschrift auch tatsächlich einzulösen.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">4. Eine dreitägige Veranstaltung, also 16 Stunden auf drei Tage verteilt</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">(Nachmittag, ganzer Tag, Vor-oder Nachmittag), zweimal schlafen, mit</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">einer Handlungsplanung am letzten Tag.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">5. Eine Dokuwand mit allen aus den Anliegengruppen entstehenden</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Ergebnissen, die nochmal von allen gegen Ende des 2. Tages gemeinsame</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">zur Kenntnis genommen wird mit der Möglichkeit, dann noch zu jedem</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Ergebnisblatt auf einem Ergänzungsblatt weitere Fragen, Hinweise, etc.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">festzuhalten.(Diese gesammelten Werke können entweder als Papierdoku in</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">der Nacht vom 2. auf den 3. Tag hergestellt werden und den Teilnehmenden</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">am dritten Tag morgens gegeben werden oder als pdf/eDoku nach der</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Veranstaltung auf einer www erscheinen, zu der die Teilnehmenden Zugang</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">haben).</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">6. Eine Kontaktliste der Teilnehmenden mit von den TeilnehmerInnen</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">überprüften Kontaktdaten für alle Teilnehmenden, die das wollen, am Ende</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">der Veranstaltung an alle Teilnehmenden für die Kommunikation nach der</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Tagung verteilen (die Kontaktliste wurde im Laufe der Veranstaltung von</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">den Teilnehmenden selber erstellt).</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">7. Kopien der Verabredungen, die in der Handlungsplanung zu den Vorhaben</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">entstanden sind, an alle Teilnehmenden innert einer Woche nach der</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Veranstaltung verschicken samt Einladung zu dem bereits bekannten</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">"Nächsten Treffen".</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">8. Deutliche Hinweise darauf, das alles von den Teilnehmenden so weit es</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">irgend möglich ist, selbst getan wird (ihre Anliegengruppen selbständig</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">organisieren,Dokublätter anfertigen,Kontaktliste erstellen...)</span></font></p>
<div><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br></div><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Für Veranstalter, die Nachhaltigkeit wollen, ist das alles sehr einfach,</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">einleuchtend, notwendig.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Für Veranstalter, die das nicht (wirklich) wollen, ist das alles eine</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">eher unüberwindbare Barriere.</span></font></p><div><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br></div><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">So, das ist das, was ich mache und ich möchte nicht, dass es als Rezept</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">verstanden wird. Wenn jemand es so ausprobiert, würde es mich</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">überraschen, wenn es nicht klappt....</span></font></p>
<div><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br></div><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Herzlich Grüße aus Berlin</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">mmp</span></font></p>
<div><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br></div><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Catherine Pfaehler wrote:</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Dear Reinhard</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> As you describe it in depth, it becomes more understandable and really</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> sounds wonderful.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> What about writing a book on methods and hints for visual protocols? I</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> especially like your idea of the participants doing the visual protocols</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> themselves. Some might even discover they have a talent they weren't aware</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> of!</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> And my original question remains open - what do others do to foster</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> sustainable outcomes?</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Heartfully, C.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> </span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Catherine Pfaehler Senn</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> lic.oec.HSG</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Open Space Begleitung</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> St. Alban-Vorstadt 15</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> CH - 4052 Basel</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> +41-(0)76 - 488 15 46</span></font></p><p>
<font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="mailto:c.pfaehler@open-space-begleitung.ch" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">c.pfaehler@open-space-begleitung.ch</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="http://www.open-space-begleitung.ch" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">www.open-space-begleitung.ch</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> </span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Von: Reinhard Kuchenmueller [mailto:<a href="mailto:mail@visuelle-protokolle.de" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">mail@visuelle-protokolle.de</a>]</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Gesendet: Samstag, 27. Juni 2009 07:01</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> An:<span> </span><a href="mailto:c.pfaehler@bluewin.ch" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">c.pfaehler@bluewin.ch</a>;<span> </span><a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Betreff: AW: How can we foster sustainable outcomes?</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Dear Catherine,</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> it seems t get a dialogue between you and me - and Harrison defending his</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> turf - while all the others are busy discussing Paris Stammtisch and some</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> problems of dogma and exegesis in the holy principles.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> My focus lies on the os meeting. My heart belongs to the paricipating</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> people, my head to the client behind everything. In a meeting of lets say</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> 200 participants everybody can choose between lets say ten group themes in</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> every time slot. If it goes for two days, with five time slots, that makes</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> 50 groups of which the everage participant chooses five groups. All the</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> other groups, their themes, their surprising developments, their exitement,</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> their outcome, does not exist for him. All the groups make some protocols,</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> but in the worst possible way, in handwriting, and some typed short version.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Our everage participant does rarely read the outcomes of other groups. The</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> facilitator made himself invisible and is of little help. So his horizon is</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> built from 10 percent of the whole meeting. He goes home with a beautiful</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> experience of team building and self organisation, and some memeory of 10</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> percent of the meeting. The client goes home with some written excerpts, and</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> if he is lucky he will be confronted with some ideas afterwards, of people</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> who want to ontinue their threads. Who is helping him to build the bridge</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> between his basic theme, his exspectations, and the outcome? The</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> facilitator? By which means?</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> I would wish all the os people could take part just once in a visualized os</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> event. Some witnesses, fair minded, impartial, are moving from group to</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> group, gathering process, results and atmosphere on small picture cards.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Nobody is noticing them. They put these picture cards into a big picture</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> wall, all the time, so that everybody who passes can get all the procedures</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> in some seconds time. And in the evening all the picture cards, digitalized</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> in the meantime, are shown to the plenum as a slide show with some music,</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> for about 10 minutes The participants not only increase the memory of their</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> own group from 20 to 60 percent, as scientists can proove, but at the same</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> time they get an overview about the whole big theme in all its complexity.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> As if they can suddenly see the whole tree, of which they were busy handling</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> some branches so far. I experienced a deep satisfaction among the</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> participants every time we did that work. Of course all that is against the</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> old os dogma, but that does not bother the people at all.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> And the client? He gets a detailled insight into all the groups. The little</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> images can be used in many ways to foster sustainable outcomes, as you say.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> They can be clustered, regrouped, with atonishing results, showing what</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> people really said and mean.They can be used as material to work with in</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> smaller groups who continue with some items, they can be put into the</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> intranet, printed as leaflets, little books, calendars, posters, hang in the</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> corridors ... As means to take the results really seriously.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> AND NOW THE BIG QUESTION: is that worth the extra costs of extra people, who</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> visualize the event? Some clients say yes, it is. It makes the difference</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> between a beautiful experience of self orgsnization and the welding of a</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> tool for the organization.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> I myself would not propose to visualize every os meeting by external</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> visualizers. I would like very much to experiment with internal</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> visualization. We developed different ways of visualizing by participants.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Once we made 800 union people in vienna draw in little groups, 72 images,</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> with an amazing result.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> I can imagine, that in every os group two or three people start to doodle,</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> to draw what they experience, on little cards. A bit like world cafe (I</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> propose to the world cafe people to use little cards as well). And then like</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> said before, the cards can be hung into the picture wall, group by geoup,</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> and shown in the evening as slide show. I would very much like to develop</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> this method and to make it available to the whole os community.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> mit freundlichen Grüßen</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> best regards</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Reinhard Kuchenmüller</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> VISUELLE PROTOKOLLE</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> tel. +39-0566 88929</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="http://www.visuelle-protokolle.de" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">www.visuelle-protokolle.de</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> ________________________________________</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Von: Catherine Pfaehler [<a href="mailto:c.pfaehler@bluewin.ch" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">c.pfaehler@bluewin.ch</a>]</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 25. Juni 2009 17:15</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> An: Reinhard Kuchenmueller</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Cc: 'OSLIST'</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Betreff: How can we foster sustainable outcomes?</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Dear Reinhard</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> You have a very interesting point there. I have often wondered how the</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> sustainable implementation of visible results can be fostered "better" by</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> me, as in the post-OS-meeting, I often find my clients to focus on different</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> things than what I would have expected.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Then, again, on the other side, I am well aware that a most important side</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> result of an OS event is always teambuilding, communication and a stronger</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> commitment to their organisation by many participants. And if I succeed in</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> allowing the client to really be responsible for what happens with the</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> results, then I need to let go after having asked the evaluation questions</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> and some others like "Does anything need a vessel for coordination now?" and</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> "What has been developing since the OS event?".</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Other opinions??</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Heartfully, C.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Catherine Pfaehler Senn</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> lic.oec.HSG</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Open Space Begleitung</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> St. Alban-Vorstadt 15</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> CH - 4052 Basel</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> +41-(0)76 - 488 15 46</span></font></p><p>
<font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="mailto:c.pfaehler@open-space-begleitung.ch" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">c.pfaehler@open-space-begleitung.ch</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="http://www.open-space-begleitung.ch" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">www.open-space-begleitung.ch</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Von: Reinhard Kuchenmueller [mailto:<a href="mailto:mail@visuelle-protokolle.de" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">mail@visuelle-protokolle.de</a>]</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Gesendet: Montag, 22. Juni 2009 19:12</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Betreff: AW: [OSLIST] Anti Laws of OST - Foundations of OST?</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> my two cents:</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> a principle is defined as a law superordinated to every other law.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Condition: A certain effect can always be retraced to the same constellation</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> of facts. (wikipedia).</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> In this sense Harrison's principles are definitively no principles at all.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> But he was really clever: two martinis and four mundane sentences - and the</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> whole world is repeating them like a mantra. Mantras, as the east knows</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> since thousands of years, don't have to have a meaning, the essence lies</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> behind them. It only gets painful, if you start to worship the mantras</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> instead of the essence.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Why is open space so effective? Certainly not because of the mantras. As I</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> see it, we have to dig deeper:</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> I could think of principles like:</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> People are basically interested - to engage themselves</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> - to take responsibility</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> - to interlink themselves</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> That happens as soon as one stops to treat people like obstinate mules.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> And there exist conditions, which foster that, which support this so called</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> self organisation.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Certainly open space technology, as it is practised worldwide, is an</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> excellent condition for self organisation.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> And your 'foundations' define it well.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Rather often a client spends money for an open space event, and for the</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> facilitator who proposes open space as a tool for the clients' purposes.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> This aspect seems to be underestimated in the debate.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> In my view the facilitator is responsible to link the proposed and choosen</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> form of the event, in our case open space, with the system and the purpose</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> of the client. What the client pays for is not the self organisation of his</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> people, that is only a beautiful side effect, and a bridge to engage people</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> in the affairs of the client - and more often simultaneously in their own</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> working conditions.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> I cannot understand the disinterest of many open space facilitators towards</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> the outcome and its linkage with the system of the client.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> That, in my eyes, is also the reason for the disinterest towards optimal</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> forms of recording the outcome - and as a visual facilitator I of course</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> propagate a visual form of protocol.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p>
<font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> The discussions in the os list are mainly conducted with the back to the</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> clients, and that is a pity.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> mit freundlichen Grüßen</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> best regards</span></font></p><p>
<font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Reinhard Kuchenmüller</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> VISUELLE PROTOKOLLE</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> tel. +39-0566 88929</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="http://www.visuelle-protokolle.de" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">www.visuelle-protokolle.de</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> ________________________________________</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Von: OSLIST [<a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a>] im Auftrag von Artur Silva</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> [<a href="mailto:arturfsilva@YAHOO.COM" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">arturfsilva@YAHOO.COM</a>]</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Gesendet: Sonntag, 21. Juni 2009 18:25</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> An:<span> </span><a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Betreff: Re: [OSLIST] Anti Laws of OST - Foundations of OST?</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Larry:</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> I am sorry but only today I had the time to answer you.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> We certainly need foundations or principles to Open Space.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> But I prefer the word "foundations" instead of "principles" because, due to</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> the man of the hat, this word is connected forever (only) with "the 4</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> principles". And I think that that there are other principles (foundations)</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> as important as, or even more important than, the 4 so called principles.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Indeed I think (sorry Harrison) that the expression "The 4 principles" was</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> badly chosen.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Because it they are "what always happens" they are not principles at all.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> And because we think that we must state the principles in the beginning of</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> every session (I myself to that the majority o the times - but not always")</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> and I am more and more convinced that they are useless. You can state them</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> or nor, and the same things will occur. They are probably "one less thing to</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> do/state".</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> But there are other principles or foundations that are essential, in the</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> sense that if they are not present different things will happen.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> In the discussion I opened in our wiki some years ago I proposed the</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> following:</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> 3. I would suggest, as HO wrote in the old User’s Guide, that OST begins</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> with:</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> * A THEME that is compelling enough, but also general and open enough to</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> let people dream about and</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> * A GROUP OF COMMITED PEOPLE (reason for the presences to be almost</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> always voluntary)</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> * Enough DIVERSITY in the group</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> 4. To those foundations one can add others that are generally accepted by</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> all practitioners:</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> * The CIRCLE (even if, in some cases, some argue that a "virtual circle"</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> will do)</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> * The Bulletin Board</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> * The Market Place</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> * The "law of two feet" (one of the most, if not the most important</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> feature, from where butterflies and bumblebees "germinate" and many</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> conflicts "evaporate")</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> * The "four principles" (as I have promised ;-)</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> (<a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/cgi/netwiki.cgi?FoundationsofOST" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://www.openspaceworld.org/cgi/netwiki.cgi?FoundationsofOST</a>)</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> If I were to rewrite this today, I would surely suppress the last line. But</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> all the other "foundations" (including the law of two feet) are essential.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> If you suppress one of them you will have a meeting; but not, IMHO, an OST</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> meeting. But we may not talk at all about the "4 principles" and everything</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> will happen as usual.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Best regrsds to all</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Artur</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> --- On Thu, 5/28/09, Larry Peterson <<a href="mailto:larry@spiritedorg.com" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">larry@spiritedorg.com</a>> wrote:</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> From: Larry Peterson <<a href="mailto:larry@spiritedorg.com" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">larry@spiritedorg.com</a>></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Subject: Re: [OSLIST] Anti Laws of OST - Foundations of OST?</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> To:<span> </span><a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Date: Thursday, May 28, 2009, 5:22 PM</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p>
<font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Maybe a “foundation” is another word for how I often describe the</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> “principles”. I encourage people, when I open a space, to make some</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> assumptions about the gathering to assume what are stated as principles and</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> to act on that basis during the event. I think these only become “assumed”</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> after some evolution of consciousness and I don’t experience most folks in</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> organizations being there. I think it is important to articulate them, to</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> influence the “social construction” of the boundaries of the OST event along</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> with the most important part – the focus question or theme. Yep, it may be</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> a bit of ritualized behaviour but I think it helps increase the</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> possibilities what will emerge in the self-organizing process that will</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> happen anyway. Besides, I (we as facilitators) are one of the “selves” in</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> the self-organization.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Larry</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Larry Peterson & Associates in Transformation</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Toronto, Ontario, Canada</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="mailto:larry@spiritedorg.com" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">larry@spiritedorg.com</a><<a href="http://us.mc546.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=larry@spi" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://us.mc546.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=larry@spi</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="http://ritedorg.com" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">ritedorg.com</a>> 416.653.4829</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="http://www.spiritedorg.com" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://www.spiritedorg.com</a><<a href="http://www.spiritedorg.com/" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://www.spiritedorg.com/</a>></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> From: OSLIST [mailto:<a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a>] On Behalf Of Artur</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Silva</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Sent: May-27-09 5:54 PM</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> To:<span> </span><a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Subject: Re: [OSLIST] Anti Laws of OST - Foundations of OST?</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Harrison, Larry and all:</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> I am afraid that I continue to read only the messages from this list from</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> time to time...</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Today, I read this answer from Harrison to a reply from Larry to an original</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> comment by Harrison. The 3 messages referred are listed below, and I ask you</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> to first read the parts of those messages that I have transformed in bold.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> (...) Thanks for having done that ;-)</span></font></p><p>
<font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Now, I am happy that Harrison agrees that "the 4 principles and one law are</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> neither laws nor principles actually" and that there will come a day when</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> The Law and The Principles can be assigned to that wonderful status of “One</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> more thing not to do.”</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> But Larry commented, very wisely as usual, about the importance of some form</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> of “boundaries” or “container” for self-organization.</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> So, maybe it is the appropriate time to reintroduce a discussion that I have</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> tried to introduce many moons ago, about what are the foundations of OST.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> I mean,</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> 1) if the principles are not "principles" after all, but only what always</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> happens, and eventually even "one more thing not to do" (and I remember you</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> that I have done some OST experiments without reference to the Principles -</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> and all went well as usual), but</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> 2) Some form of boundary or container is needed</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> where this boundary or container does comes from?</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> I have proposed to call that the "foundations" (not principles) of OST and</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> proposed some ideas (that are only preliminary ideas) I would like to read</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> (again) your opinions about.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> You can found my (preliminary) proposals, of some time ago, here</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/cgi/netwiki.cgi?FoundationsofOST" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://www.openspaceworld.org/cgi/netwiki.cgi?FoundationsofOST</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> and here</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="http://listserv.boisestate.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind0401&L=oslist&P=R23925&I=-3&" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://listserv.boisestate.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind0401&L=oslist&P=R23925&I=-3&</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> X=6543D44B5D0A7C3BC4&Y=arturfsilva%<a href="http://40yahoo.com" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">40yahoo.com</a>.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Looking forward to hear from you all</span></font></p><p>
<font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Warn regards from a warm night in Lisbon</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Artur</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> ------</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> --- On Wed, 5/27/09, Harrison Owen <<a href="mailto:hhowen@verizon.net" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">hhowen@verizon.net</a>> wrote:</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> From: Harrison Owen <<a href="mailto:hhowen@verizon.net" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">hhowen@verizon.net</a>></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Subject: Re: [OSLIST] Anti Laws of OST</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> To:<span> </span><a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Date: Wednesday, May 27, 2009, 7:23 AM</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Right on Larry – and I found a very curious and embarrassing typo in my</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> small piece. I said, “They (the Principles and the Law) are descriptive as</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> opposed to descriptive.” I meant to say,”They are descriptive as opposed to</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> prescriptive.” Point is neither the Law nor the Principles tell you what to</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> do – they simply alert everybody to what will be taking place no matter</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> what. I think that is a useful function, but it really doesn’t change a</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> thing. In short – there will come a day when The Law and The Principles can</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> be assigned to that wonderful status of “One more thing not to do.”</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Harrison</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Harrison Owen</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> 7808 River Falls Drive</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Potomac, Maryland 20854</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Phone 301-365-2093</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Skype hhowen</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Open Space Training<span> </span><a href="http://www.openspaceworld.com" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">www.openspaceworld.com</a><<a href="http://www.openspaceworld.com/" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://www.openspaceworld.com/</a>></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Open Space Institute<span> </span><a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">www.openspaceworld.org</a><<a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://www.openspaceworld.org/</a>></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Personal website<span> </span><a href="http://www.ho-image.com" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">www.ho-image.com</a><<a href="http://www.ho-image.com/" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://www.ho-image.com/</a>></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> OSLIST: To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Visit:</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="http://www.listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">www.listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html</a><<a href="http://listserv.boisestate" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://listserv.boisestate</a>.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> edu/archives/oslist.html></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> -----Original Message-----</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> From: OSLIST [mailto:<a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a>] On Behalf Of Larry</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Peterson</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Sent: Wednesday, May 27, 2009 9:44 AM</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> To:<span> </span><a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Subject: Re: Anti Laws of OST</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> For me, there is more sense in the “Principles and Law” than non-sense.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Stewart Kauffman explores the importance of some form of “boundaries” or</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> “container” for self-organization, particularly that of cells. He believes</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> (with strong scientific evidence) that real physical work only gets done</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> within some “boundaries” or it dissipates. Cells, he asserts, co-create</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> their “boundaries” with their environment through self-organizing</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> relationships in every moment. The boundaries are permeable, constructs,</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> open to interchange with their environment. (No such thing as a closed</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> system!)</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Harrison, I believe you have articulated a set of socially constructed</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> permeable “boundaries” for enhancing human self-organization – including the</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> focus/theme, principles and law. These set a temporary set of “boundaries”</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> or a “container” both focused and open that change the perceived conditions</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> for self-organization at an event or meeting. Self-organization is</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> happening all the time, in every moment. Our mental maps (in practice) and</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> feelings shape what we do as we self-organize – what topics we propose and</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> who we connect to. Are they necessary for self-organization (Open Space) –</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> no, it is happening all the time as order emerges. Do they (or other</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> similar statements about the social framework for our self-organizing) help</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> people to self-organize in exciting and creative ways? I think so.</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Larry</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Larry Peterson & Associates in Transformation</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Toronto, Ontario, Canada</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="mailto:larry@spiritedorg.com" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">larry@spiritedorg.com</a><<a href="http://us.mc546.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=larry@spi" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://us.mc546.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=larry@spi</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="http://ritedorg.com" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">ritedorg.com</a>> 416.653.4829</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="http://www.spiritedorg.com" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://www.spiritedorg.com</a><<a href="http://www.spiritedorg.com/" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://www.spiritedorg.com/</a>></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> From: OSLIST [mailto:<a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a>] On Behalf Of Harrison</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Owen</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Sent: May-25-09 2:59 PM</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> To:<span> </span><a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Subject: Re: [OSLIST] Anti Laws of OST</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p>
<font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Just to render the whole thing non-sensical, the 4 principles and one law</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> are neither laws nor principles actually. To be honest they are just my (and</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> others’) observations of what seemed to be happening in any case. In a word</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> they are descriptive as opposed to descriptive – You could say it is all a</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> joke. Rather like “technology” in the phrase Open Space Technology. The</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> joke, however turned out to be outrageously funny – because somehow or</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> another truth broke through. We are in serious trouble! Everybody knows that</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> what happens in Open Space simply can’t happen. Unfortunately it does – and</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> that makes a joke out of a whole mess of other stuff – like most of what we</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> think we know about meetings, the management of meetings, and management</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> itself. Double trouble!!</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Harrison</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Harrison Owen</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> 7808 River Falls Drive</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Potomac, Maryland 20854</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Phone 301-365-2093</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Skype hhowen</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Open Space Training<span> </span><a href="http://www.openspaceworld.com" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">www.openspaceworld.com</a><<a href="http://www.openspaceworld.com/" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://www.openspaceworld.com/</a>></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Open Space Institute<span> </span><a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">www.openspaceworld.org</a><<a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://www.openspaceworld.org/</a>></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> Personal website<span> </span><a href="http://www.ho-image.com" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">www.ho-image.com</a><<a href="http://www.ho-image.com/" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://www.ho-image.com/</a>></span></font></p>
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<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> edu/archives/oslist.html></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> .org/oslist</span></font></p>
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<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs:<span> </span><a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist</a></span></font></p>
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<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html</a><span> </span>To learn about</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs:<span> </span><a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> * * ==========================================================</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a><span> </span>------------------------------ To subscribe,</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="mailto:oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu</a>:</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html</a><span> </span>To learn about</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs:<span> </span><a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> *</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> *</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> ==========================================================</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> -----------------------------</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options,</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> view the archives of<span> </span><a href="mailto:oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu</a>:</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs:</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> *</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> *</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> ==========================================================</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> ------------------------------</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options,</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> view the archives of<span> </span><a href="mailto:oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu</a>:</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">> To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs:</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">><span> </span><a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">></span></font></p><div><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br></div><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">--</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Michael M Pannwitz, boscop eg</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Draisweg 1, 12209 Berlin, Germany</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">++49-30-772 8000</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"><a href="mailto:mmpanne@boscop.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">mmpanne@boscop.org</a></span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"><a href="http://www.boscop.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">www.boscop.org</a></span></font></p><div><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br>
</div><div><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br></div><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Check out the Open Space World Map presently showing 447 resident Open</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Space Workers in 71 countries working in a total of 140 countries worldwide</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Have a look:</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"><a href="http://www.openspaceworldmap.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">www.openspaceworldmap.org</a></span></font></p>
<div><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br></div><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">*</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">*</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">==========================================================</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">OSLIST</span></font>@<a href="http://LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">------------------------------</span></font></p><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options,</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">view the archives of<span> </span><a href="mailto:oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu</a>:</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"><a href="http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html</a></span></font></p>
<div><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></font><br></div><p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs:</span></font></p>
<p><font size="2" face="Courier New"><span style="font-size: 10pt;"><a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist</a></span></font></p>
</div></div>* * ==========================================================<span> </span><a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a><span> </span>------------------------------ To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of<span> </span><a href="mailto:oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu</a>:<span> </span><a href="http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html</a><span> </span>To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs:<span> </span><a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist</a></blockquote>
</div><br><div></div>* * ==========================================================<span> </span><a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a><span> </span>------------------------------ To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of<span> </span><a href="mailto:oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu</a>:<span> </span><a href="http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html</a><span> </span>To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs:<span> </span><a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline;" target="_blank">http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist</a></div>
</span></blockquote></div><br></div></div>*
*
==========================================================
<a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU" target="_blank">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a>
------------------------------
To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options,
view the archives of <a href="mailto:oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu" target="_blank">oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu</a>:
<a href="http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html" target="_blank">http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html</a>
To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs:
<a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist" target="_blank">http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist</a>
</blockquote></div><br>
*
*
==========================================================
OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU
------------------------------
To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options,
view the archives of oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu:
http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html
To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs:
http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist