<html><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div>In the spirit of Dean Radin's "entanglement" </div><div><br></div><div>I've got you under my skin </div><div>I've got you deep in the heart of me</div><div>So deep in my heart, that you're really a part of me</div><div>I've got you under my skin.</div><div><div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#474747" face="'Times New Roman', -webkit-fantasy" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 15px; line-height: 23px;"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000" face="'Helvetica Neue'"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: medium; line-height: normal;"><br></span></font></span></font></div><div><div apple-content-edited="true"> <span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: 'Helvetica Neue'; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verdana; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verdana; font-size: 13px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verdana; font-size: 13px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri; font-size: 13px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#260E89"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="color: rgb(0, 128, 0); font-family: Webdings; font-size: 32px; "><b><span style="font-size: 7pt; font-family: Arial; color: green; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri; font-size: 13px; font-weight: normal; "><span><span><span><span><span><font class="Apple-style-span" face="'Lucida Handwriting'"><i><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#260E89">Christine</font></i></font><br><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 128, 0); font-family: Arial; font-size: 9px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: bold; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri; font-size: 13px; font-weight: normal; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#260E89"><br class="Apple-interchange-newline">Christine Whitney Sanchez</font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#260E89"><i>Collaborative Wisdom & Strategy</i><br class="Apple-interchange-newline">480.759.0262 </font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#260E89"><a href="http://www.christinewhitneysanchez.com">www.christinewhitneysanchez.com</a><span class="Apple-style-span" style="color: rgb(0, 128, 0); font-family: Webdings; font-size: 32px; "><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Webdings; color: green; "></span></span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#260E89">Skype: christinewhitneysanchez</font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#260E89"><a href="http://www.facebook.com/ChristineWhitneySanchez">http://www.facebook.com/ChristineWhitneySanchez</a></font></div></div></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></b></span></font></div></span></div></span></div></span></div></span></div></span> </div><br><div><div>On Jun 21, 2009, at 7:45 PM, Phelim McDermott wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-family: Arial; font-size: 16px; "><font class="txt_1" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 11px; color: red; "><div class="KonaBody" style=""><div id="div_customCSS" style=""><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#0F0F0F" style="">Skin<br style=""><br style="">You gotta have skin.<br style="">All you really need is skin.<br style="">Skin's the thing that if you got it outside,<br style="">It helps keep your insides in.<br style=""><br style=""></font><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#0F0F0F" style=""><br><b style="font-size: 16px; ">(Nothing can match it when ya scratch it)</b><br><br></font></div><div id="div_customCSS" style=""><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#0F0F0F"><br></font></div></div></font></span></div><div>Phelim <br><div><div>On 21 Jun 2009, at 12:30, Artur Silva wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0; "><div><table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" border="0" style="position: static; z-index: auto; "><tbody><tr><td valign="top" style="font: inherit; "><div><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">I agree, Robyn.</span></div><div><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "></span> </div><div><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">But the point is: are the 4 principles part of your skin or some dust you can get rid of - or not - without changing the skin?<o:p></o:p></span></div><div><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "> <o:p></o:p></span></div><div><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">Artur<o:p></o:p></span></div><div><br><br>--- On<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b>Thu, 5/28/09, Robyn Williams<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><i><<a href="mailto:pov@iinet.net.au">pov@iinet.net.au</a>></i></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>wrote:<br></div><blockquote style="border-left-color: rgb(16, 16, 255); border-left-width: 2px; border-left-style: solid; padding-left: 5px; margin-left: 5px; "><br>From: Robyn Williams <<a href="mailto:pov@iinet.net.au">pov@iinet.net.au</a>><br>Subject: Re: [OSLIST] Anti Laws of OST - Foundations of OST?<br>To:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a><br>Date: Thursday, May 28, 2009, 7:11 PM<br><br><div id="yiv1408674077"><div class="Section1"><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right: 0cm; margin-left: 0cm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; ">(...)</span></p></div><div style="margin-right: 0cm; margin-left: 0cm; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; ">When I was a kid in the late sixties my folks had a record by comedian Shelley Berman. Hilarious, I loved it. He sang a ditty to the tune of “You’ve gotta have heart (buda-bom)”. The opening lyrics went something like, “You gotta have skin, it’s the only thing that keeps your insides in…”. Its wisdom has rung in my ears ever since. No wonder I’m into the practice of peace.</span></p><div><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Trebuchet MS', sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 10pt; ">Cheers, Robyn</span></p></div><div><span style="font-family: 'Trebuchet MS', sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 10pt; "> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Trebuchet MS', sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 10pt; ">Robyn Williams</span><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Trebuchet MS', sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 10pt; ">POV Communication for Sustainability</span><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Trebuchet MS', sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 10pt; ">M: 0424 587 262</span><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Trebuchet MS', sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 10pt; ">E:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><span style="font-family: 'Trebuchet MS', sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "><a href="http://us.mc546.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=pov@iinet.net.au" rel="nofollow" target="_blank" ymailto="mailto:pov@iinet.net.au"><span style="color: blue; font-size: 10pt; ">pov@iinet.net.au</span></a></span><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "></span></p><div><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div><div style="border-bottom-width: medium; border-bottom-style: none; border-bottom-color: initial; border-left-width: medium; border-left-style: none; border-left-color: initial; padding-bottom: 0cm; padding-left: 0cm; padding-right: 0cm; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: 1pt; border-top-style: solid; border-right-width: medium; border-right-style: none; border-right-color: initial; padding-top: 3pt; "><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>OSLIST [<a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU">mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a>]<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b>On Behalf Of<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Larry Peterson<br><b>Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Friday, 29 May 2009 8:22 AM<br><b>To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a><br><b>Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [OSLIST] Anti Laws of OST - Foundations of OST?</span></p></div></div><div> <br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; ">Maybe a “foundation” is another word for how I often describe the “principles”. I encourage people, when I open a space, to make some assumptions about the gathering to assume what are stated as principles and to act on that basis during the event. I think these only become “assumed” after some evolution of consciousness and I don’t experience most folks in organizations being there. I think it is important to articulate them, to influence the “social construction” of the boundaries of the OST event along with the most important part – the focus question or theme. Yep, it may be a bit of ritualized behaviour but I think it helps increase the possibilities what will emerge in the self-organizing process that will happen anyway. Besides, I (we as facilitators) are one of the “selves” in the self-organization.</span></p><div><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; ">Larry</span></p><div><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; ">Larry Peterson & Associates in Transformation</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; ">Toronto, Ontario, Canada</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "><a href="http://us.mc546.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=larry@spiritedorg.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank" ymailto="mailto:larry@spiritedorg.com"><span style="color: blue; ">larry@spiritedorg.com</span></a> 416.653.4829<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://www.spiritedorg.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><span style="color: blue; ">http://www.spiritedorg.com</span></a></span></p><div><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div style="border-bottom-width: medium; border-bottom-style: none; border-bottom-color: initial; border-left-width: medium; border-left-style: none; border-left-color: initial; padding-bottom: 0cm; padding-left: 0cm; padding-right: 0cm; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: 1pt; border-top-style: solid; border-right-width: medium; border-right-style: none; border-right-color: initial; padding-top: 3pt; "><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>OSLIST [<a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU">mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a>]<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b>On Behalf Of<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Artur Silva<br><b>Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>May-27-09 5:54 PM<br><b>To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a><br><b>Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [OSLIST] Anti Laws of OST - Foundations of OST?</span></p></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA"> </span><table class="MsoNormalTable" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0"><tbody><tr><td valign="top" style="padding-bottom: 0cm; padding-left: 0cm; padding-right: 0cm; padding-top: 0cm; "><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">Harrison, Larry and all:</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">I am afraid that I continue to read only the messages from this list from time to time...</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">Today, I read this answer from Harrison to a reply from Larry to an original comment by Harrison. The 3 messages referred are listed below, and I ask you to<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b>first read the parts of those messages</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>that I have transformed in bold.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">(...) Thanks for having done that ;-)</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">Now, I am happy that Harrison agrees that "<b><span style="color: red; ">the 4 principles and one law are neither laws nor principles actually"<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></b>and that<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b><span style="color: red; ">there will come a day when The Law and The Principles can be assigned to that wonderful status of “One more thing not to do.”</span></b></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">But Larry commented, very wisely as usual, about </span><b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">the importance of some form of “boundaries” or “container” for self-organization</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">. </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">So, maybe it is the appropriate time to reintroduce a discussion that I have tried to introduce many moons ago, about what are the foundations of OST.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">I mean,</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">1) if the principles are not "principles" after all, but only what always happens, and eventually even "one more thing not to do" (and I remember you that I have done some OST experiments without reference to the Principles - and all went well as usual), but</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"> <span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">2) Some form of boundary or container is needed</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">where this boundary or container does comes from? </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">I have proposed to call that the "foundations" (not principles) of OST and proposed some ideas (that are only preliminary ideas) I would like to read (again) your opinions about.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">You can found my (preliminary) proposals, of some time ago, here </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "><a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/cgi/netwiki.cgi?FoundationsofOST" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US">http://www.openspaceworld.org/cgi/netwiki.cgi?FoundationsofOST</span></a></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"> <span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">and here</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"> </p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "><a href="http://listserv.boisestate.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind0401&L=oslist&P=R23925&I=-3&X=6543D44B5D0A7C3BC4&Y=arturfsilva%40yahoo.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US">http://listserv.boisestate.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind0401&L=oslist&P=R23925&I=-3&X=6543D44B5D0A7C3BC4&Y=arturfsilva%40yahoo.com</span></a></span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">Looking forward to hear from you all</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">Warn regards from a warm night in Lisbon</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">Artur</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"> </p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">------</span></p><div><div><p class="MsoNormal"> </p></div></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><br><br>--- On<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b>Wed, 5/27/09, Harrison Owen<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><i><<a href="mailto:hhowen@verizon.net">hhowen@verizon.net</a>></i></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>wrote:</p></div><blockquote style="border-bottom-width: medium; border-bottom-style: none; border-bottom-color: initial; border-left-color: rgb(16, 16, 255); border-left-width: 1.5pt; border-left-style: solid; padding-bottom: 0cm; margin-top: 5pt; padding-left: 3pt; padding-right: 0cm; margin-bottom: 5pt; margin-left: 3pt; border-top-width: medium; border-top-style: none; border-top-color: initial; border-right-width: medium; border-right-style: none; border-right-color: initial; padding-top: 0cm; "><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12pt; "><br>From: Harrison Owen <<a href="mailto:hhowen@verizon.net">hhowen@verizon.net</a>><br>Subject: Re: [OSLIST] Anti Laws of OST<br>To:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a><br>Date: Wednesday, May 27, 2009, 7:23 AM</p><div id="yiv1364242186"><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; ">Right on Larry – and I found a very curious and embarrassing typo in my small piece. I said, “They (the Principles and the Law) are descriptive as opposed to descriptive.” I meant to say,”They are descriptive as opposed to prescriptive.”<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><strong><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; ">Point is neither the Law nor the Principles tell you what to do – they simply alert everybody to what will be taking place no matter what.</span></strong><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>I think that is a useful function,<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><strong><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; ">but it really doesn’t change a thing</span></strong>.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><strong><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; ">In short – there will come a day when The Law and The Principles can be assigned to that wonderful status of “One more thing not to do.”</span></strong></span></p></div></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; ">Harrison</span></p></blockquote><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; "> </span></p><div><p align="center" style="text-align: center; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; font-size: 10pt; ">Harrison Owen</span></p></div><p align="center" style="text-align: center; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; font-size: 10pt; ">7808 River Falls Drive</span></p><p align="center" style="text-align: center; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; font-size: 10pt; ">Potomac, Maryland 20854</span></p><p align="center" style="text-align: center; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; font-size: 10pt; ">Phone 301-365-2093</span></p><p align="center" style="text-align: center; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; font-size: 10pt; ">Skype hhowen</span></p><p align="center" style="text-align: center; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; ">Open Space Training</span><span style="color: red; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://www.openspaceworld.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: blue; ">www.openspaceworld.com</span></a></span></p><p align="center" style="text-align: center; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; ">Open Space Institute</span><span style="color: red; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: blue; ">www.openspaceworld.org</span></a></span></p><p align="center" style="text-align: center; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; ">Personal website</span><span style="color: red; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://www.ho-image.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: blue; ">www.ho-image.com</span></a></span></p><p align="center" style="text-align: center; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; ">OSLIST: To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives Visit:</span><span style="color: red; "><a href="http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: blue; ">www.listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html</span></a></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">-----Original Message-----<br><b>From:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>OSLIST [<a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU">mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a>]<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b>On Behalf Of<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Larry Peterson<br><b>Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Wednesday, May 27, 2009 9:44 AM<br><b>To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a><br><b>Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: Anti Laws of OST</span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "> </p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; ">For me, there is more sense in the “Principles and Law” than non-sense.</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Stewart Kauffman explores<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><strong><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">the importance of some form of “boundaries” or “container” for self-organization</span></strong>, particularly that of cells.</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>He believes (with strong scientific evidence) that<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><strong><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">real physical work only gets done within some “boundaries” or it dissipates</span></strong>.</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Cells, he asserts, co-create their “boundaries” with their environment through self-organizing relationships in every moment.</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>The boundaries are permeable, constructs, open to interchange with their environment. (No such thing as a closed system!)</span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; ">Harrison,<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><strong><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">I believe you have articulated a set of socially constructed permeable “boundaries” for enhancing human self-organization</span></strong><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>– including the focus/theme, principles and law.</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>These set a temporary set of “boundaries” or a “container” both focused and open that change the perceived conditions for self-organization at an event or meeting.</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Self-organization is happening all the time, in every moment.</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Our mental maps (in practice) and feelings shape what we do as we self-organize – what topics we propose and who we connect to.</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Are they necessary for self-organization (Open Space) – no, it is happening all the time as order emerges.</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; ">Do they (<strong><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">or other similar statements</span></strong><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>about the social framework for our self-organizing) help people to self-organize in exciting and creative ways?<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; ">I think so.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; ">Larry</span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; ">Larry Peterson & Associates in Transformation</span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; ">Toronto, Ontario, Canada</span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "><a href="http://us.mc546.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=larry@spiritedorg.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><span style="color: blue; ">larry@spiritedorg.com</span></a></span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>416.653.4829<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://www.spiritedorg.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><span style="color: blue; ">http://www.spiritedorg.com</span></a></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt; "> </span></p><div><div style="border-bottom-width: medium; border-bottom-style: none; border-bottom-color: initial; border-left-width: medium; border-left-style: none; border-left-color: initial; padding-bottom: 0cm; padding-left: 0cm; padding-right: 0cm; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: 1pt; border-top-style: solid; border-right-width: medium; border-right-style: none; border-right-color: initial; padding-top: 3pt; "><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "><b><span style="font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; ">From:</span></b><span style="font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>OSLIST [<a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU">mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a>]<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b>On Behalf Of<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Harrison Owen<br><b>Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>May-25-09 2:59 PM<br><b>To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a><br><b>Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [OSLIST] Anti Laws of OST</span></p></div></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "> </p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; ">Just to render the whole thing non-sensical,<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><strong><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; ">the 4 principles and one law are neither laws nor principles actually</span></strong>. To be honest<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><strong><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; ">they are just my (and others’) observations of what seemed to be happening in any case</span></strong>. In a word they are descriptive as opposed to descriptive – You could say it is all a joke.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><strong><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; ">Rather like “technology” in the phrase Open Space Technology</span></strong>. The joke, however turned out to be outrageously funny – because somehow or another truth broke through. We are in serious trouble! Everybody knows that what happens in Open Space simply can’t happen. Unfortunately it does – and that makes a joke out of a whole mess of other stuff – like most of what we think we know about meetings, the management of meetings, and management itself. Double trouble!!</span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; ">Harrison</span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; "> </span></p><div><p align="center" style="text-align: center; margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; font-size: 10pt; ">Harrison Owen</span></p></div><p align="center" style="text-align: center; margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; font-size: 10pt; ">7808 River Falls Drive</span></p><p align="center" style="text-align: center; margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; font-size: 10pt; ">Potomac, Maryland 20854</span></p><p align="center" style="text-align: center; margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; font-size: 10pt; ">Phone 301-365-2093</span></p><p align="center" style="text-align: center; margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; font-size: 10pt; ">Skype hhowen</span></p><p align="center" style="text-align: center; margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; ">Open Space Training</span><span style="color: red; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://www.openspaceworld.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: blue; ">www.openspaceworld.com</span></a></span></p><p align="center" style="text-align: center; margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; ">Open Space Institute</span><span style="color: red; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: blue; ">www.openspaceworld.org</span></a></span></p><p align="center" style="text-align: center; margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; ">Personal website</span><span style="color: red; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://www.ho-image.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: blue; ">www.ho-image.com</span></a></span></p><p align="center" style="text-align: center; margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; ">OSLIST: To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives Visit:</span><span style="color: red; "><a href="http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: blue; ">www.listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html</span></a></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 36pt; "><span style="font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: red; "> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal">.org/oslist</p></td></tr></tbody></table></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; "><br>* * ========================================================== <a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a> ------------------------------ To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of <a href="mailto:oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu">oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu</a>:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html">http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist">http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist</a></span></p><p class="MsoNormal">* * ========================================================== <a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a> ------------------------------ To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of <a href="mailto:oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu">oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu</a>:<a href="http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html">http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs:<a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist">http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>* * ========================================================== <a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a> ------------------------------ To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of <a href="mailto:oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu">oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu</a>:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html">http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist">http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist</a></p></blockquote></td></tr></tbody></table><br>* * ==========================================================<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>------------------------------ To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu">oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu</a>:<a href="http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html">http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs:<a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist">http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist</a></div></span></blockquote></div><br></div></div></div>* * ========================================================== OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU ------------------------------ To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu: <a href="http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html">http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html</a> To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs: <a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist">http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist</a></div><br></div></div></div></body></html>*
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To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options,
view the archives of oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu:
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