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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Hi Harrison and OST family…
reading this response made be remember why OST is so attractive to me. It’s
simple and it works. As an NLP teacher, that’s the first thing I tell my
students… make it simple and keep in mind the question “Does it
work?”.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Something else, thanks <st1:place
w:st="on">Harrison</st1:place> for being honest and letting us know how it all
started… I think I take myself too seriously sometimes, trying to justify
what I do, so that it sounds reliable or with a proven background or whatever…
and then I remember a good friend of mine some of you may or may not know,
Michael Lightweaver, who says when he realizes he’s taking things too
seriously: Do you really believe that in 200 years anyone will remember how
important you were?<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Love to all of you and thanks
again for simplicity!<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=5 color=black face=Papyrus><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:18.0pt;font-family:Papyrus;color:black'>Elisabeth Tepper Kofod</span></font><font
color=black><span lang=EN-US style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Venezuela<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Century Schoolbook"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Century Schoolbook";color:black'>+58 212
986 4254</span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Century Schoolbook"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Century Schoolbook";color:black'>+58 416
424 7359</span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Century Schoolbook"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Century Schoolbook";color:black'>+58 424
256 5855</span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
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face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>De:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> OSLIST
[mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU] <b><span style='font-weight:bold'>En
nombre de </span></b>Harrison Owen<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Enviado el:</span></b> jueves, 11 de junio de
2009 07:51 a.m.<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Para:</span></b>
OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Asunto:</span></b> Re: [OSLIST] I guess RE:
Open Space being badly defined</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>Erik -- Not to worry about accusation. It is doubtless
deserved. But let's go a little bit further. On the question of values, you
mention that OST was "rooted in a set of values." That would suggest
that we started with a set of values and then designed OST to match -- would it
not? But the truth of the matter is rather different. I simply had a conference
to run, and was too lazy and lacked sufficient time to do what most people did
(Planning groups, etc). To ease the pain and enjoy the Washington Spring I had
two martinis on my patio in April of 1985. By the end of the second (martini)
OST had been born -- Sit in a circle, create a bulletin board, open a market
place, and go to work. In July we (85 folks) "did it" and it worked,
which is to say we created a 5 day symposium with multiple sessions all of
which took place with little to no fuss. Not a planning committee or management
committee in sight. It wasn't that we were anti-planning or management; neither
were needed. Of course that raises all sorts of questions about the
utility/effectiveness of planning and management but none of us went there at
that point. Indeed it was only 4-5 years later that I really took OST seriously
and began to consider the questions it raised. Those questions were appalling,
for if valid virtually everything I knew from theory and practice about the
management of meetings, indeed management itself -- all went poof. Not a
comfortable experience only made worse by the fact that I discovered that
client groups were able to accomplish in 2 days what had been taking them ten
months to two years. The effect on my billable hours was catastrophic. At some
level I almost wish that I had never drunk the martinis. I could have made a
lot more money and nobody would be thinking that what I did was weird, to say
nothing of counterintuitive and heretical (in need of “rebranding” </span></font><font
face=Wingdings><span lang=EN-US style='font-family:Wingdings'>J</span></font><span
lang=EN-US>). <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>A saving grace was the fact that Open Space is fun,
and that people are fun to be with in Open Space. That has been true for me all
over the world. I guess there are people who don't want to have any fun and run
away when folks get excited, innovative, creative and intense -- after all
things could get out of control! God love them and for sure they can be as
miserable as the want. I won't say a word. But for my self I truly enjoy a
full, open, joyous, fun life -- and wouldn't have it any other way. Ah -- you
got me! My values are sneaking through.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><st1:place w:st="on"><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt'>Harrison</span></font></st1:place><span
lang=EN-US><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>Harrison Owen<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><st1:Street w:st="on"><st1:address w:st="on"><font
size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt'>189
Beaucaire Ave</span></font></st1:address></st1:Street><span lang=EN-US><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on"><font size=2
face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt'>Camden</span></font></st1:City><span
lang=EN-US>, <st1:State w:st="on">ME</st1:State> <st1:PostalCode w:st="on">04843</st1:PostalCode></span></st1:place><span
lang=EN-US><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>207-763-3261 (Summer)<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>301-365-2093 (Winter)<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>Website www.openspaceworld.com <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>Personal Website www.ho-image.com <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><st1:PersonName w:st="on"><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt'>OSLIST</span></font></st1:PersonName><span
lang=EN-US> To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options
http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>-----Original Message-----<br>
From: <st1:PersonName w:st="on">OSLIST</st1:PersonName> [mailto:<st1:PersonName
w:st="on">OSLIST</st1:PersonName>@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU] On Behalf Of Erik
Fabian<br>
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2009 10:53 PM<br>
To: <st1:PersonName w:st="on">OSLIST</st1:PersonName>@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU<br>
Subject: Re: I guess RE: Open Space being badly defined<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>Hi Harrison,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>Thanks for your comments. I am very impressed with OS.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>I am not trying to accuse you of anything, I just
observe that OS is rooted in a set of values. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>Nothing wrong with that...I think they are good
values, openness being the primary one, fun being <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>another...but I hope you can agree with me that not
everyone would agree with openness or fun <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>being a positive or even preferential value in every
situation and culture...even if OS has worked <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>cross-culturally and we think we know better eh.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>I also observe OS in theory and practice as being
inclusive to any value set (if you can accept the <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>basic ground rules...sort of like the way religious
freedom exists in secular <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:country-region w:st="on">America</st1:country-region></st1:place>
by enforcing <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>that residents not to persecute believers of other
faiths)...folks can create a session as they see fit <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>and are bound to express their own values in that
session...but getting folks to give an OS event a <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>try in the first place is still a leap for some (well
more likely many) folks. For instance if you value <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>strict order and hierarchy then OS might seem like a
waste of time.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>I am full of opinions and could go on but I hope you
get my point.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>I heard that when Zen got started they just asked
folks to sit there and do nothing, just <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>observe...that wasn't working so well so they
eventually realized that most people needed a bit <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>more structure, so they added few more instructions.
Structure seems to have its uses for creating <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>digestible products. And in the end enlightenment is
enlightenment is enlightenment is it not?<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>Cheers,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>Erik<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>On Wed, 10 Jun 2009 16:04:49 -0400, Harrison Owen
<hhowen@verizon.net> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>Eric -- I am really curious about the "<st1:place
w:st="on"><st1:PlaceType w:st="on">Church</st1:PlaceType> of <st1:PlaceName
w:st="on">OS</st1:PlaceName></st1:place>." I am very clear that I<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>never created such a thing, advocated its start,
or propagated its future. I<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>grant you that it began with Great Spirit -- but
two martinis will do that<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>for you. Probably the largest issue is that OS is
just too simple. If we<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>could just make it more complicated, we might get
more respect. But at the<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>end of the day, and on everyday for the past 25
years OST requires only that<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>you sit in a circle, create a bulletin board, open
a market place, and go to<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>work. I guess there must be values in there
somewhere, probably having<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>something to do with going to work. But even that
one doesn't work too well,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>because OS usually turns out to be fun. And
everybody knows that work is not<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>fun, and if you are having fun, clearly you are
not working. So I am not too<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>sure about this rebranding stuff. Actually, I
think we might want to keep it<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>all secret. After all if you can do serious work
and have fun doing it --<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>that is obviously illegal, immoral and fattening.
You wouldn't want it to<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>get around.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><st1:place w:st="on">Harrison</st1:place><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>Harrison Owen<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><st1:Street w:st="on"><st1:address w:st="on">189
Beaucaire Ave</st1:address></st1:Street><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on">Camden</st1:City>,
<st1:State w:st="on">ME</st1:State> <st1:PostalCode w:st="on">04843</st1:PostalCode></st1:place><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>207-763-3261 (Summer)<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>301-365-2093 (Winter)<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>Website www.openspaceworld.com<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>Personal Website www.ho-image.com<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><st1:PersonName w:st="on">OSLIST</st1:PersonName>
To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>-----Original Message-----<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>From: <st1:PersonName w:st="on">OSLIST</st1:PersonName>
[mailto:<st1:PersonName w:st="on">OSLIST</st1:PersonName>@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU]
On Behalf Of Erik<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>Fabian<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2009 3:15 PM<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>To: <st1:PersonName w:st="on">OSLIST</st1:PersonName>@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>Subject: Re: Open Space being badly defined<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>Hi Kaliya,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>I have visited your sites in the past and
appreciate all the information you<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>share. I also appreciate<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>you advocacy for getting this community more
engaged with the unconference<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>zeitgeist.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>Leaving the wiki articles aside for a moment, I
hear you saying a few<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>things:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>1) OS needs to update its marketing and repostion
its brand if it is not to<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>be confused with things<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>like barcamps.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>2) There is confusion among the folks who create
"participatory" events<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>about the tools OS offers<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>and the values behind those tools. (The problem of
definition)<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>3) People who care about OS, such as the people on
this list, should be<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>taking care to steward the<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>OS information that is in the public like on the
wiki's. They should act.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>Here is my two-cents:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>I think OS is a beautiful form but is one of many
approaches to structuring<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>participation. The<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>problem I see is that OS is presented as a set of
values more so than a<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>tool. A minority shares the<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>values that are expressed by OS and not everyone
is in the position to take<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>the risk necessary to<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>participate in OS if they don't believe that the
outcomes are superior to a<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>traditional event. Only a<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>minority of folks are ever going to want to join
the <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceType w:st="on">church</st1:PlaceType> of <st1:PlaceName
w:st="on">OS</st1:PlaceName></st1:place>.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>I like that OS is a "technology", and
like "open source", it is a technology<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>that can be used to build<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>various applications. In that sense the openness
is important and it also<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>affirms that OS is an<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>insight into something fundamental about getting
together in a participatory<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>way. I think this is<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>the best move they could have made.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>I am not too worried about definition. There isn't
a ton of info on OS<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>available but there is plenty.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>It is in both book form and online. I would note
however that the language<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>and marketing of OS<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>could use some updating for younger generations.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>Perhaps Barcamps fail as an app, but they are
winning as a marketing<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>campaign. Like any event, I<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>find that many folks are not going to Barcamps
because they are<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>participatory but because they<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>are trendy and hosting by folks who are cool. Same
thing is happening with<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>Pecha Kuchas.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>I support you in pointing out that the Wiki is an
important front for<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>controlling perception of OS,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>especially in the minds of the IT community. If
there are folks on this<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>board who are invested in<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>this fight, I second Kaliya advocacy to start
editing the entry.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>But in the end I would rather just see more hip OS
events, with updated<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>language, more marketing<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>savvy, and that reach into more industry
sectors. If Barcamps fail as an<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>app, then I say so be it...it<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>is creating an opportunity for other events. At
least that is were I am<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>focusing my efforts.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>Thanks for the ideas. I hope we will have the
chance to chat further<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>sometime.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>Cheers,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>Erik<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>On Wed, 10 Jun 2009 09:29:31 -0700, Kaliya *
<identitywoman@gmail.com><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>On Mon, Jun 8, 2009 at 11:51 PM, <st1:PersonName
w:st="on">Holger Nauheimer</st1:PersonName> (Change Facilitation) <<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>holger@change-facilitation.org> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> Hi Kaliya,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> although I don't want to interfere with
this particular Wikipedia<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>article,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>Why not?<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> Iam not very happy with your edition. Let
me explain, and let us try to<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> find<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> some common ground:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> 1. Bar Camps are derived from Open Space
Technology. They are a crude<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> adaptation of the principles and leave
out a couple of essential elements<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> of<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> OST. But they are still self-organized
meetings (with less of magic, I<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> agree)<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> 2. I have never attended a Bar Camp where
somebody claimed that this was<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>ON<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> OST. People say, "this is a Bar Camp."<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>I agree AND BarCamp's are lame...most people
have negative experiences and<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>it gives the whole field of participant driven
events a bad name.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> 3. I believe that it is good that
principles of self-organization<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> ("un-conference") have entered
into other areas of life and society,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> whether<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> one calls it OST, Bar Camp, World Caf�
etc. I don't care much for the<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> names,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> as long a meeting is about passion and
responsibility. In this sense,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> Harrison, and all we followers have
contributed to a better world, or at<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> least, to better meetings.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> 4. The way you phrased it in your
revision ("FooCamp derived some of its<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> process from Open Space Technology but
left out key elements like having<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> the<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> agenda making process facilitated and
leaving out sharing the 4<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>principles<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> of Open Space and Law of Two feet that
help frame how people act<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>throughout<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> the day. Closing wrap-up the
"evening news" of how the day went was also<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> left out. Since BarCamp is a
"replication" of FooCamp it also changed -<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> making yet farther removed from the
original method.") focuses on the<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> differences and leaves a kind of negative
imprint.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>YES! THAT WAS THE POINT.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>I have been to both (FooCamp - twice [in my
other life in the technical<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>world focused on online digital identity I
"rate" high enough to be invited<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>to them] - the original BarCamp and several
camps since organized by techie<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>geeks who wave their arms and sort of hope for
it to happen). I have had<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>and watch others have negative experiences
(and less then fully realized<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>potential of these gatherings) cause they left
out key important parts and<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>"think" they are doing it well and
as if those key elements don't matter.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> But it is great that<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> people do Bar Camps, isn't it? We, as an
OST movement shouldn't try to<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> distinguish us from the Bar Camp movement
but rather looking more at the<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> common ground.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>I completely disagree.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>> I think we need to be clear our method has
key things that are good,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>essential and not to be forgotten and
encourage ADOPTION OF THESE things.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> That will give OST also a greater
exposure. Many young people<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> know Bar Camps but they don't know OST.
So here is a chance to be a<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> "missionary" and tell them -
you can do even more with some simple<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> procedures.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> 5. I propose (but leave it up to you) to
rephrase this particular article<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> in<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> the following way: "FooCamps and
BarCamps are based on a simplified<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> variation of Open Space Technology (OST),
leaving out some key elements<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> like<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> the 4 principles and the Law of the Two
Feet but maintaining the<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> self-organizing character of OST. Other
than in classical conference<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> formats, BarCamps and OST rely on the
passion and the responsibility of<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>the<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> participants, putting them into the
driver's seat."<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>Sure - make the edit then.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> 6. I agree with your remarks on the
article on Open-space meetings and<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>have<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> just entered the following comment into
the discussion:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> "I believe this article is redundant
and confusing and should be either<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> deleted or merged with [[Open Space
Technology]]. What would be reason to<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> keep this one? Open Space meetings don't
exist. There is Open Space<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> Technology, and there are meetings that
are done in an Open Space like<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>> style. But this is too fuzzy for a single
article."<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>Great.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>*<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>*<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>==========================================================<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><st1:PersonName w:st="on">OSLIST</st1:PersonName>@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>------------------------------<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your
options,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>view the archives of
oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and <st1:PersonName
w:st="on">OSLIST</st1:PersonName> FAQs:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>>http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>*<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>*<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>==========================================================<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><st1:PersonName w:st="on">OSLIST</st1:PersonName>@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>------------------------------<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>view the archives of
oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and <st1:PersonName
w:st="on">OSLIST</st1:PersonName> FAQs:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
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<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>*<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>*<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>==========================================================<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><st1:PersonName w:st="on">OSLIST</st1:PersonName>@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>------------------------------<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and <st1:PersonName
w:st="on">OSLIST</st1:PersonName> FAQs:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>>http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>*<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>*<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>==========================================================<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><st1:PersonName w:st="on"><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt'>OSLIST</span></font></st1:PersonName><span
lang=EN-US>@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>------------------------------<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>view the archives of oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and <st1:PersonName
w:st="on">OSLIST</st1:PersonName> FAQs:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt'>http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</body>
</html>
*
*
==========================================================
OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU
------------------------------
To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options,
view the archives of oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu:
http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html
To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs:
http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist
*
*
==========================================================
OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU
------------------------------
To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options,
view the archives of oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu:
http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html
To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs:
http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist