generally, patricia, i'd say it's hard to know anything from one data point. one point that is made up of hundreds of embedded choices. ost is practice. sometimes it's bumpy, or surprising, or whatever. my inclination would be to have a good think over all the details, noticing without deciding anything, and then staying the course as best as you can. i think that after your noticing without deciding, there might be a moment come up in the second or third meetings in which you might decide something, and might decide to take a breath, raise your voice, change your pace, or whatever, differently than before. or it might be that you do everything exactly the same (miracle!) and something entirely different happens. that's the part that's almost guaranteed... do it again and something different will happen. good luck! m<br>
<br><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 11:12 AM, Patricia Haines <<a href="mailto:levelgreeninstitute@yahoo.com">levelgreeninstitute@yahoo.com</a>> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
Michael & Friends:<br>
I could use help assessing what worked and what didn't<br>
about the OS at this past weekend's GREEDNING THE ARTS<br>
Symposium in Ithaca.<br>
<br>
The audience was small but very knowledgeable, so the<br>
quality of conversation was very high - but they ended<br>
up NOT wanting to break into OS groups, rather wanted<br>
to stay together as one group. In retrospect that<br>
didn't work well, at least after the first hour.<br>
<br>
During this initial time we got some superb 'bullet'<br>
points down on newsprint. When we switched to action<br>
plans, however, the concept of focusing on ACTION<br>
didn't click - and we ended up on Saturday morning<br>
spinning wheels.<br>
<br>
A lot of solid next steps DID come out of the weekend,<br>
and enthusiasm is high for continuing to develop the<br>
project (project is ARTS AT THE HEART OF A SUSTAINABLE<br>
WORLD, global initiative to integrate the arts more<br>
visibly and pro-actively throughout the sustainability<br>
movement).<br>
<br>
BUT - the plan has been to hold a series of OS-based<br>
gatherings at various places in the US, Europe, Asia<br>
and Africa, to make sure we give voice at the<br>
vision/planning table to the myriad perspectives,<br>
approaches, interests and needs that are out there.<br>
<br>
now I'm wondering if OS is the best way to go for this<br>
process. The panel part of this past weekend's<br>
program - short presentations followed by discussion<br>
- was really great. But the small-group OS didn't work<br>
well - just made folks unfamiliar with the process<br>
confused and annoyed.<br>
<br>
Thoughts? thanks - Patricia Haines<br>
<div><div></div><div class="Wj3C7c">--- Michael Herman <<a href="mailto:michael@michaelherman.com">michael@michaelherman.com</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
> hallo jack, interesting question...<br>
><br>
> for me, the dogma comes mainly from outside, not<br>
> within the community.<br>
> dogma like "people won't come if there's not a big<br>
> name keynoter" or "people<br>
> need warm-up icebreakers" or "we could never do more<br>
> than a half-day (...on<br>
> the future/survival of the organization!" ...or some<br>
> such) or "everybody<br>
> needs to hear everything" or even... "there's always<br>
> a way to improve<br>
> something and so we're going to mess with this<br>
> world-renown process before<br>
> we've actually tried it even once." how about "oh,<br>
> yes, there's already a<br>
> committee that's supposed to be handling that<br>
> (really big question) (never<br>
> mind that nobody can remember the last time they<br>
> met) so we need to focus on<br>
> just this (small question) for this (short) meeting.<br>
><br>
> if there is an ost 'establishment,' this list must<br>
> be it. and here i see<br>
> regular inventions and experiments and also the<br>
> occasional diving into the<br>
> question of what's essential ost. i've said for<br>
> years now, in the process<br>
> of adapting ost to all kinds of (hostile, to the<br>
> standard model)<br>
> environments, that it's most important to do the<br>
> practice and notice for<br>
> oneself those things that seem essential.<br>
> invitation, circle, marketplace,<br>
> breathing or what i usually generalize to<br>
> 'pulsation', bulletin board. lots<br>
> of different ways to create these same mechanisms.<br>
> embedded in these things<br>
> are voluntary self-selection, real purpose,<br>
> responsibility, documentation,<br>
> and some other things we've discussed here for<br>
> years.<br>
><br>
> personally, i'm not as interested in discussion<br>
> aimed at nixing 'dogma' that<br>
> might get in the way here or there as i am in<br>
> understanding through direct<br>
> experience the barest essence of what actually does<br>
> work, so that i can be<br>
> smarter still about what not to do... and what NOT<br>
> not to do... and more<br>
> importantly, how TO DO those things that some<br>
> situations demand, in ways<br>
> that are most consistent with the essence of what<br>
> we're up to with ost.<br>
><br>
> have a good chat and i hope you'll bring the notes<br>
> back to post here. i'm<br>
> sure there are corners of the world where dogma is<br>
> getting in the way of<br>
> opening space... ost dogma perhaps, and lots of<br>
> other dogma, too!<br>
><br>
> cheers, m<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 8:01 AM, Jack Martin Leith<br>
> <<a href="mailto:jack@jackmartinleith.com">jack@jackmartinleith.com</a>><br>
> wrote:<br>
><br>
> > Hiya Harrison.<br>
> ><br>
> > Happy that you're not offended by our undertaking!<br>
> ><br>
> > Maybe it's different on your side of the pond, but<br>
> Paul and I have both,<br>
> > separately, noticed the worrying extent to which<br>
> OS certainly has become a<br>
> > dogma over here, sometimes along with the words<br>
> "Harrison Owen" says. (I<br>
> > must put my hand up to having done that many<br>
> times.) We both feel that OS<br>
> > has become somewhat arthritic, and overdue for a<br>
> rethink.<br>
> ><br>
> > What you say is perfectly true, and I agree<br>
> wholeheartedly ... although I'm<br>
> > personaly keen on conversation that precipitates<br>
> action ... but all too<br>
> > often it's very different on the ground.<br>
> ><br>
> > Big thanks for your support and encouragement.<br>
> We'll keep you posted. Steve<br>
> > the Doc has already signed up for the Skype<br>
> option.<br>
> ><br>
> > Very best,<br>
> ><br>
> > Jack<br>
> ><br>
> > Jack Martin Leith<br>
> > Bristol, United Kingdom<br>
> > Mobile: 07831 840541 (+44 7831 840541)<br>
> > Skype: jackmartinleith<br>
> > Facebook:<br>
> <a href="http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=725422325" target="_blank">www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=725422325</a><br>
> > Facebook group on Open Space Technology:<br>
> > <a href="http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=7189220743" target="_blank">www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=7189220743</a><br>
> > LinkedIn: <a href="http://www.linkedin.com/in/jackmartinleith" target="_blank">www.linkedin.com/in/jackmartinleith</a><br>
> > email: <a href="mailto:jack@jackmartinleith.com">jack@jackmartinleith.com</a><br>
> > <a href="http://www.jackmartinleith.com" target="_blank">www.jackmartinleith.com</a><br>
> ><br>
> > 2008/4/30 Harrison Owen <<a href="mailto:hhowen@verizon.net">hhowen@verizon.net</a>>:<br>
> ><br>
> >> Sounds like a marvelous under taking, but I am<br>
> not sure about all this<br>
> >> "Dogma" business. Dogma in my lexicon is a whole<br>
> bunch of stuff that you<br>
> >> have to do/believe. My experience with OST is<br>
> that it is all about thinking<br>
> >> of one more thing NOT to do – or believe. The end<br>
> of the line, or indeed the<br>
> >> next iteration, would involve doing nothing at<br>
> all, and where "belief"<br>
> >> translated into pure experience. You were just<br>
> "there" in that present<br>
> >> moment being fully what you (we) already were –<br>
> full, conscious, passionate,<br>
> >> responsible human beings. My experience with most<br>
> of the 2nd Generation<br>
> >> Open Spaces is that they seem to involve more and<br>
> different doing and<br>
> >> believing. To my eyes this seems to be going in<br>
> the wrong direction. But<br>
> >> what do I know? Have fun!!<br>
> >><br>
> >><br>
> >><br>
> >> Harrison<br>
> >><br>
> >><br>
> >><br>
> >> Harrison Owen<br>
> >><br>
> >> 7808 River Falls Drive<br>
> >><br>
> >> Potomac, Maryland 20854<br>
> >><br>
> >> Phone 301-365-2093<br>
> >><br>
> >> Skype hhowen<br>
> >><br>
> >> Open Space Training <a href="http://www.openspaceworld.com" target="_blank">www.openspaceworld.com</a><br>
> >><br>
> >> Open Space Institute <a href="http://www.openspaceworld.org" target="_blank">www.openspaceworld.org</a><br>
> >><br>
> >> Personal website <a href="http://www.ho-image.com" target="_blank">www.ho-image.com</a><br>
> >><br>
> >> OSLIST: To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your<br>
> options, view the<br>
> >> archives Visit:<br>
><br>
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> --<br>
><br>
> Michael Herman<br>
> Michael Herman Associates<br>
><br>
> <a href="http://www.michaelherman.com" target="_blank">http://www.michaelherman.com</a><br>
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