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Hi Doug, I like this :<BR>
<BR>
For the listener, who listens in the snow,<BR>
And nothing himself, beholds<BR>
Nothing that is not there and nothing that is..<BR> - Wallace Stevens<BR><BR>
<BR>
well Doug i really don't know if i live life or life lives me :-) something is actual and moving. Our thoughts help us in many ways but i dont know if we can really have control over life with our thoughts, or grab the energy of life and use it.. there are lots of concepts about power of thought, ok to all, but i have witnessed some people who lost their health because of too much thinking, or believing they can solve everything with thought. <BR>
<BR>
I felt very silent and felt that i dont know and probably will not know anything about life through thoughts when i witnessed someone (who i loved very much) dying, and i felt very silent also when we brought my new born nephew to home, it was like heaven came with him, no words were there to express anything... <BR>
i don't try to live these experiences in my mind again and again, they just passed, but somehow - i don't know this is an experience or not -i felt something silent is and will be with me all the time in life, at any moment. However, i really don't know if i have any point of view of how to be silent, i don't know if it happens with process oriented therapies, hours of meditation which give back pain, or trying to stop the mind with mantras, etc. for me it is something about trust. and now i heard some real good word from Lisa - which is "interfaith".<BR>
<BR>
... and about the question, the relation between change and thought, i want to ask it later, in a detailed way. <BR>
by having new experiences about how the cultural and social structures that are organized with too much "me" thought work so poorly, at the moment i am in a silent shock :-)))) lol<BR>
<BR>
i don't remember the book's name , just another quotation: <BR>
"human is not the only animal that can think but it is the only animal who thinks only he thinks"<BR>
:-) <BR>
<BR>
funny isn't it?<BR>
<BR>
c<BR><BR><BR><BR>
<HR id=stopSpelling>
> Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2007 19:34:24 -0400<BR>> From: 76066.515@compuserve.com<BR>> Subject: Re: Facilitator must be part of the conversations<BR>> To: OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU<BR>> <BR>> Can--<BR>> <BR>> Thanks for carrying this conversation deeper!<BR>> <BR>> <BR>> <BR>> On Fri, 2007-08-03 at 11:02 +0000, can uludag wrote:<BR>> > the nature of our self seem to be about silence rather than thought,<BR>> > and silence is not the background of our lives, it's the foreground.<BR>> <BR>> That's taking me new places, Can. Would you say more about what this<BR>> means to you, where the idea comes from?<BR>> <BR>> > Ask yourself who am i? you may have a lot of thoughts.. but if<BR>> > you don't answer to the question, only live it, you are you, you are<BR>> > left with what it is, something silent and very actual, simply<BR>> > life.. not a spiritual concept :))<BR>> <BR>> Would it not also be a spiritual concept? Could you say more, Can?<BR>> <BR>> > <BR>> > My question will be, what is the relation between thought and change??<BR>> <BR>> Can, what is your way of addressing that question?<BR>> <BR>> :- Doug.<BR>> <BR>> *<BR>> *<BR>> ==========================================================<BR>> OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU<BR>> ------------------------------<BR>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options,<BR>> view the archives of oslist@listserv.boisestate.edu:<BR>> http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html<BR>> <BR>> To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs:<BR>> http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist<BR><BR><br /><hr />Make every IM count. Download Windows Live Messenger and join the i’m Initiative now. It’s free. <a href='http://im.live.com/messenger/im/home/?source=TAGWL_June07' target='_new'>Make it count!</a></body>
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