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<DIV><FONT face="Trebuchet MS" color=#000080>Thanks a lot, dear Arno, Harrison,
John and Raffi, for your sharing your wisdoms and experiences!</FONT></DIV><FONT
face="Trebuchet MS" color=#000080>
<DIV><BR></FONT><FONT face="Trebuchet MS" color=#000080>Background of my
question was, that based on my international online work with
OpenSpace-Online, I know how important translations and single words are.
No question: face-to-face OST is the most unreachable enriching and powerful way
(for facilitators and for participants) to do meetings and that here the words
can become quickly secondary. My big bang visionary momentum was based on the
deep love to f2f OS and it was totally without words - it was just knowing and
seeing. And over the years, having so much to do with different cultures across
distances and with groups who are not able to meet f2f and who are communicating
not in their first language, I know how different the "meaning of a phrase"
can be understood in our world.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Trebuchet MS" color=#000080></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Trebuchet MS" color=#000080>Thank you all and have a great
day!<BR><BR>Warmly,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Trebuchet MS" color=#000080>Gabriela</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Trebuchet MS" color=#000080></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000080 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=john@johnengle.net href="mailto:john@johnengle.net">John Engle</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU
href="mailto:OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU">OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, May 10, 2007 2:16
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: whatever happens...</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>Thanks for your response, Arno.<BR><BR>It's so important that
translation captures the essence.<BR><BR>In Haiti, the direct translation of
the principle uses the same language that has been used in the past by radical
groups indicating, "if your car get's blown up, if your windshield or head
get's crushed by a rock or a bullet, it's that what happened. We're on the
warpath for change. Violence and destruction is likely to happen."<BR><BR>John
<BR><BR><B><I>Arno Baltin <arno@tlu.ee></I></B> wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: rgb(16,16,255) 2px solid">Dear
Gabriela, and others,<BR><BR>In Estonian the printciple is translated so
that "what ever happens" is <BR>understood as something that will happen in
future (although we dont <BR>have grammatical future). At the same time
"happens" has in everyday use <BR>mostly negative connotation. When a child
comes to parent with unhappy <BR>face, the parent will probably ask "what
happened?". Or there is a <BR>saying "we will be friends whatever happens".
So when people first time <BR>hear the principle of "what ever happens" in
OS it sounds a bit like a <BR>warning that things might go "wrong" but there
is still no need to worry <BR>about it. If in English "happens" and "happy"
sounds quite similar (at <BR>least to foreigners ear) then in Estonian
closest association with <BR>"happens" is "accident".<BR><BR>with best
regards,<BR><BR>Arno<BR><BR><BR>Gabriela Ender wrote:<BR>> Dear John, and
others,<BR>><BR>> I want to come back to your wonderful thoughts
regarding this <BR>> principle because I like the way you have been
experimenting in <BR>> Haitian Creole and in English with very much:
"*What Happens is what <BR>> happens - learn and move forward."*<BR>>
<BR>> And you have added: "This principle helps us to not lament over
<BR>> should'ves, to not wallow in regrets. We're all responsible for how
we <BR>> use our time and space together during this meeting. Let's
assume that <BR>> responsibility and be prepared to accept what happens
and to <BR>> continually strive to learn and to keep moving
forward."<BR>> <BR>> I totally agree and I like they way you describe
it!<BR>> <BR>> I have a question. Would it be also okay to say: "*What
happened is <BR>> what happened - learn and move forward*." ? I mean
"What happened is <BR>> what happened" (it is past - so we cannot change
it anymore) and <BR>> "learn and move forward." is present ... with
responsibility in my/our <BR>> "here and now".<BR>> "What happens is
what happens" sounds for me (as a foreign English <BR>> speaking person)
like it is the present and for "here and now" we are <BR>> responsible
... how we use our time. Therefore I think that <BR>> changing the first
part of this principle variant "into past" could <BR>> express the "when
its over its over" in it a bit better and would make <BR>> a distinction
to present and concsious responsibilty.<BR>> I would appreciate your and
the opinion from others a lot. Thank you <BR>> very much!<BR>><BR>>
Warmly,<BR>> Gabriela<BR>> * *
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<BR><BR>*<BR>*<BR>==========================================================<BR>OSLIST@LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU<BR>------------------------------<BR>To
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FAQs:<BR>http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist<BR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR><BR><SPAN
style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"></SPAN><A
href="http://johnengle.net">www.johnengle.net</A> Open space
facilitation<BR><A style="COLOR: rgb(0,0,255)"
href="http://circlesofchange.com">www.circlesofchange.com</A> Participatory
learning and leadership<BR><A
href="http://harvesttime.cc">www.harvesttime.cc</A> <SPAN
style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"></SPAN>Harvesting for justice that all may
have enough<BR><BR>telephone Haiti: 509-461-3067<BR><BR>email:
john@johnengle.net <BR>telephone: 202-236-6532 <BR>fax: 202-449-8343
<BR><BR>John Engle <BR>P.O. Box 337 <BR>Hershey, PA 17033 * *
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