[OSList] What would a harvest from a long OSList discussion look like?
Chris Kloth
chris.kloth at got2change.com
Mon Aug 11 13:34:11 PDT 2014
I have been slow to respond to the "harvest" thread because I had
rotator cuff surgery two weeks ago and now I can only keyboard with
one hand... so please be patient if typos and syntax are awkward.
That said, what I found most engaging about the earlier thread was the
blend of inquiry, connectivity, dissonance, links to other bases of
experience (aka - models) on deeper and broader planes, etc. than I
have seen in a while.
I know there has been lots of good stuff over the years, and I know
much/most of it is accessible in the cloud. For some reason this
thread seemed especially rich... less about OST methods or comparative
methodologies... more about underlying beliefs about people and
systems filtered through the lenses of experience.
Probably a reflection of my advanced age, I kept thinking somewhere in
here is a book. While I love my hard copy books, I'm not as attached
to the paper as I am to the idea of a document or other text-based
tool that makes me uncomfortable.
I love all of Harrison's books, but after my first OST 20+ years ago
they have never made me uncomfortable. As I have continued to use OST
as a significant part of my work each book helped me develop of deeper
understanding of my experience and potential, which extended my
comfort level at using OST in settings people told me could never deal
with it. While I was tested early, I have yet to find such a group.
As I was preparing to go to the hospital I found some of the
observations and questions in the last thread were troubling me... in
a good way. They challenged me to test my assumptions about
differentiation, integration and alignment with respect to various
assertions about the best and worst in people and systems, as well as
the cultural contexts of some of the observations. I found myself
calling up Chris Argyris's Ladder of Inference to sort out some of my
own reactions and to frame questions I was curious about.
I also found myself struck by my reactions to various expressions and
assertions about the role embedded in terms like facilitator, host,
convener, consultant and the fantasies related to power and control
when people react to or coach on how "best" to carry out that role...
whether that might refer to one right way or how to choose among
options based on diverse settings. I found myself wondering about the
extent to which the manner in which people (including myself) express
what makes sense is a projection, taps into a deeper truth, both or
something else.
I'm not quite sure where else to take this ramble, but the meds are
kicking in so I better stop now.
--
Shalom,
Chris Kloth
ChangeWorks of the Heartland
254 South Merkle Road
Bexley, OH 43209-1801
ph 614-239-1336
fax 614-237-2347
www.got2change.com
Think globally. Act locally.
Quoting Harold Shinsato <harold at shinsato.com>:
> Michael thank you for pulling out that first OSList email. Wow, how
> we've grown! Look at these stats:
>
> 1996
> - 57 people on OSList
>
> 2014
> - 787 people on OSList
> - 2017 people on Facebook Open Space Technology group -
> https://www.facebook.com/groups/7189220743
> - 1642 people on LinkedIn Open Space Technology group -
> https://www.linkedin.com/groups?home=&gid=81286
> - 801 people on Open Space World Ning community -
> http://openspaceworld.ning.com/
> - 49 people in the "Open Space" Google Plus Circle -
> https://plus.google.com/stream/circles/p70fe5c7a8a52f291
>
> (Please, if anyone knows of any other public Open Space forums,
> please let me know!)
>
> Although in many ways the alternate technologies used outside the
> OSList are superior to the OSList, and mostly the numbers
> signifantly more, the depth of conversations on the OSList still
> remain superior.
>
> How could appropriate technology deepen the engagement? John, I'm
> very grateful that you're thinking and working on this. The
> self-organizing system of the universe I'm sure will find a way, no
> matter what we do. Thank you for starting a thread to think about
> this.
>
> Individual minds and hearts definitely do the best harvesting, but I
> see no reason that technology can't help support the process with
> visualizations, voting, tagging, and other possible wisdom of the
> crowd processes. It would also be wonderful if we could do more
> small group work on the OSList, like in an Open Space, where only
> selections of smaller conversations can get pushed out to the rest
> of us.
>
> A vision: in the (near) future, the OSList evolves into a technology
> that supports this without losing the simplicity of simple email
> engagement (for those who want it), and at the same time increasing
> our current depth, passion, relationships, engagement, and yes,
> love. Certainly not diminishing it, which unfortunately is what I
> see (at least right now) on facebook etc.
>
> Cheers,
> Harold
>
> On 8/11/14 4:55 AM, Michael M Pannwitz wrote:
>> Dear John,
>>
>> you asked:
>>
>> "...are OS List discussions available at a public URL somewhere?"
>>
>> At the bottom of each email I get from OSLIST it says:
>>
>> OSLIST To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the
>> archives of OSLIST Go to:
>>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>>
>> and, even more directly to the archives itself
>>
>>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/pipermail/oslist-openspacetech.org/
>>
>> Seems to be public enough which at one time in the past led to deep
>> discussion on ownership of these gems!
>>
>> Here is the very first message back from December 13, 1996 that
>> Murli sent to the original list of 57 os-nicks
>>
>> Friends, OpenSpacers, and worldfolk,
>> prompted by Peggy?s posting I?ve set up a discussion list for all
>> who have email. Any message posted to this list will automatically
>> be distributed to anyone subscribed to this list. This way we can
>> have an unstructured discussion going in open cyberspace...
>> Peace
>> murli
>>
>> Have a great day
>> Greetings from Berlin
>> mmp
>>
>> PS: In my experience harvesting, documenting, evaluating, writing
>> books about,...etc.... are close to nothing compared with how I
>> impacted myself with open space events. So here is my suggestion:
>> Go out and convene an os-event, it will make your day!
>>
>> On 11.08.2014 09:10, John Baxter wrote:
>>> Yes I think wordclouds are probably about the best you can get without
>>> the input of human minds and fingers... I'd be very eager to know of
>>> anything automated that could do a better job!
>>>
>>> One option to ease the burden is a shared online editable document
>>> (Google Docs or hackpad) and find a few contributors to at least share
>>> the effort, with the added benefit of multiple perspectives (and methods
>>> of recording).
>>>
>>> This could be built in as part of the structure of conversation, much as
>>> we might have a closing circle at an Open Space gathering... with
>>> everybody invited to draw out the lessons or points that they thing most
>>> worth sharing.
>>>
>>> Ideally this practice could form part of the culture of conversation?
>>> people will contribute more readily if they know it is coming, and have
>>> personal experience of seeing the value of it.
>>> This 'summing up' is one element of face-to-face that seems almost
>>> completely absent online...
>>>
>>> Another thing to keep in mind is referring back to source... are OS List
>>> discussions available at a public URL somewhere? Linking back increases
>>> the versatility of a harvest, and decreases the pressure to capture it
>>> all, giving people flexibility to paraphrase (synthesise).
>>>
>>> A few cents there for the circle...
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> */John Baxter/*
>>> jsbaxter.com.au <http://www.jsbaxter.com.au>
>>> 0405 447 829
>>> @jsbaxter_ <http://twitter.com/jsbaxter_>
>>>
>>> /note my reclamation policy means I process my inbox once daily, if that./
>>> /happy to hear about anything urgent via phone or Twitter/
>>> /
>>> /
>>> /"Reclaiming quality of life one hack at a time"/
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Aug 9, 2014 at 8:15 AM, Harrison Owen <hhowen at verizon.net
>>> <mailto:hhowen at verizon.net>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Chris -- Definitely still there! And very current I think. So folks
>>> have a read... Harvests of days gone by and still useful...____
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> ho____
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> Winter Address____
>>>
>>> 7808 River Falls Drive____
>>>
>>> Potomac, MD 20854____
>>>
>>> 301-365-2093 <tel:301-365-2093>____
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> Summer Address____
>>>
>>> 189 Beaucaire Ave.____
>>>
>>> Camden, ME 04843____
>>>
>>> 207-763-3261 <tel:207-763-3261>____
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> Websites____
>>>
>>> www.openspaceworld.com <http://%20www.openspaceworld.com>____
>>>
>>> www.ho-image.com <http://www.ho-image.com>____
>>>
>>> OSLIST To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the
>>> archives of OSLIST Go
>>> to:http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org____
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> *From:*OSList [mailto:oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org
>>> <mailto:oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org>] *On Behalf Of
>>> *Chris Corrigan
>>> *Sent:* Friday, August 08, 2014 4:01 PM
>>>
>>>
>>> *To:* World wide Open Space Technology email list
>>> *Subject:* Re: [OSList] What would a harvest from a long OSList
>>> discussion look like?____
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> You can still find that incredible document hosted at Micheal?s
>>> site:____
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> http://www.michaelherman.com/publications/ost_nonguide.pdf____
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> Chris____
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> On Aug 8, 2014, at 12:05 PM, Harrison Owen <hhowen at verizon.net
>>> <mailto:hhowen at verizon.net>> wrote:____
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ____
>>>
>>> Lucas ? Don?t know where this fits, but several years ago Michael
>>> Herman and Chris Corrigan put together what they called a Non-User?s
>>> Guide which is essentially an annotated collection of a particularly
>>> rich set of discussions here on OSLIST. I haven?t checked, but I
>>> think it is still available onwww.openspaceworld.org
>>> <http://www.openspaceworld.org/>May turn out that human
>>> minds/fingers are still an essential part of the process no matter
>>> the technology. My thought would be Graduate Students. Good labor at
>>> a reasonable price with a possible dissertation or two.____
>>>
>>> ____
>>>
>>> Harrison____
>>>
>>> ____
>>>
>>> Winter Address____
>>>
>>> 7808 River Falls Drive____
>>>
>>> Potomac, MD 20854____
>>>
>>> 301-365-2093 <tel:301-365-2093>____
>>>
>>> ____
>>>
>>> Summer Address____
>>>
>>> 189 Beaucaire Ave.____
>>>
>>> Camden, ME 04843____
>>>
>>> 207-763-3261 <tel:207-763-3261>____
>>>
>>> ____
>>>
>>> Websites____
>>>
>>> www.openspaceworld.com____
>>>
>>> www.ho-image.com____
>>>
>>> OSLISTTo subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the
>>> archives of OSLIST Go
>>> to:http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org____
>>>
>>> ____
>>>
>>> *From:*OSList [mailto:oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org]*On
>>> Behalf Of*Lucas Cioffi
>>> *Sent:*Friday, August 08, 2014 2:52 PM
>>> *To:*World wide Open Space Technology email list
>>> *Subject:*Re: [OSList] What would a harvest from a long OSList
>>> discussion look like?____
>>>
>>> ____
>>>
>>> Hi All,____
>>>
>>> ____
>>>
>>> Someone reached out and suggested I try a word cloud of the
>>> conversation. I took a few minutes to copy the 50 emails from the
>>> conversation entitled "Management and Organization" which has been
>>> running for the past month. I pasted it below, and if the word cloud
>>> doesn't come through as an attachment, you can also see it online
>>> here.____
>>>
>>> ____
>>>
>>> Word clouds are helpful, but I'm still left wanting more. I can't
>>> put my finger on it.____
>>>
>>> ____
>>>
>>> I'm thinking that there must be some very creative harvesting
>>> methods used by facilitators in this group, using graphic
>>> facilitation and other methods.* Are your approaches to in-person
>>> harvesting applicable to harvesting one of our 50-email
>>> discussions?*____
>>>
>>> ____
>>>
>>> I'm listening to see if I can create a software for harvesting &
>>> summarizing email threads to unlock some of the knowledge buried in
>>> the OSList archives and breath new life into some of our dormant yet
>>> valuable discussion threads from the past.____
>>>
>>> ____
>>>
>>> Lucas Cioffi
>>> Co-Founder, Bark!Best
>>> Charlottesville, VA
>>> 917-528-1831 <tel:917-528-1831>____
>>>
>>> ____
>>>
>>> ____
>>>
>>> ____
>>>
>>> <image002.jpg>____
>>>
>>> ____
>>>
>>> On Fri, Aug 8, 2014 at 12:23 PM, Lucas Cioffi <lucas at barkbest.com
>>> <mailto:lucas at barkbest.com>> wrote:____
>>>
>>> Hi All,____
>>>
>>> ____
>>>
>>> So this week many of us are watching a lively discussion thread grow
>>> and grow and grow. It's awesome that it has received nearly 50
>>> email replies already from people all over the world, however 95% of
>>> the people on the list aren't active in it yet, and of course that's
>>> OK.____
>>>
>>> ____
>>>
>>> For me and probably others, digging into such a large conversation
>>> becomes a bit intimidating when the conversation is so large. ____
>>>
>>> *Question: So, what would a harvest from such a long OSList email
>>> discussion look like if it was to be useful to you personally?*____
>>>
>>> ____
>>>
>>> I'm asking the question above for two reasons:____
>>>
>>> * For me: Aside from being a longtime OS enthusiast, I'm building
>>> a tool for large online conversations and looking for ideas
>>> about how to create meaningful harvests from them.____
>>> * For all of us: Unrelated to my tool, maybe if there was an easy
>>> way to harvest/summarize these long and lively conversations on
>>> OSList, then it could give access to the conversation to those
>>> who do not have the time or courage to dive in directly.____
>>> * New voices: The younger generations spend less time on email, so
>>> they largely miss out on the great knowledge that's shared on a
>>> list like this. So harvests might be one way to bring new
>>> voices to our conversations on OSList.____
>>>
>>> To get the most value out of a conversation, someone certainly has
>>> to ride along and read most of it. But the problem is that when
>>> someone chooses to read one conversation in-depth, they are choosing
>>> to not read another great conversation in-depth. So I'm hoping that
>>> a harvest can help people when they decide which conversations they
>>> want to invest their time in.____
>>>
>>> ____
>>>
>>> I look forward to hearing any suggestions!____
>>>
>>> --____
>>>
>>> Lucas Cioffi____
>>>
>>> Co-Founder, Bark!Best____
>>>
>>> Charlottesville, VA____
>>>
>>> 917-528-1831 <tel:917-528-1831>____
>>>
>>> ____
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> OSList mailing list
>>> To post send emails toOSList at lists.openspacetech.org
>>> <mailto:OSList at lists.openspacetech.org>
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>>> __ __
>>>
>>>
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>>
>
>
> --
> Harold Shinsato
> harold at shinsato.com <mailto:harold at shinsato.com>
> http://shinsato.com
> twitter: @hajush <http://twitter.com/hajush>
>
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