[OSList] Open Space Economics? Be Prepared to be Surprised!

Michael M Pannwitz mmpannwitz at gmail.com
Fri Oct 4 05:55:03 PDT 2013


Or, as Marvin and Sandra say in their wonderful book "Dont Just Do 
Something, Stand there!":
"Whatever people do ... is the best they are capable of at this moment." 
(page 68 in the chapter titled "Let people be responsible.")
ciao
mmp

On 04.10.2013 13:11, Bui Petersen wrote:
> Or perhaps it's better to say that we're not all equally good at
> utilizing our gifts.
>
> Bui
>
> On 03/10/2013 6:13 PM, Harrison Owen wrote:
>>
>> Bui – I would disagree. We are all and most certainly equally gifted
>> when it come to Opening Space... if only because no special gifts are
>> required except a good head and a good heart. And I am sure you have
>> both. I think Michael P’s lengthy note says it all, so far as I am
>> concerned. Opening Space is a natural act, indeed space opens of its
>> own accord unless it has been firmly closed by someone who thinks they
>> are in charge. Even that doesn’t really change the situation, they
>> just think it does, but their efforts do make our efforts more
>> difficult. At such times, I find the Law of Two feet particularly
>> useful, and my two questions (conditions) – self selection and all
>> issues on the table – make it clear for me when I should take a hike.
>>
>> Harrison
>>
>> Harrison Owen
>>
>> 7808 River Falls Dr.
>>
>> Potomac, MD 20854
>>
>> USA
>>
>> 189 Beaucaire Ave. (summer)
>>
>> Camden, Maine 04843
>>
>> Phone 301-365-2093
>>
>> (summer) 207-763-3261
>>
>> www.openspaceworld.com <www.openspaceworld.com%20>
>>
>> www.ho-image.com <www.ho-image.com%20> (Personal Website)
>>
>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of
>> OSLIST Go
>> to:http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>>
>> *From:*oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org
>> [mailto:oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org] *On Behalf Of *Bui
>> Petersen
>> *Sent:* Thursday, October 03, 2013 1:59 PM
>> *To:* World wide Open Space Technology email list
>> *Subject:* Re: [OSList] Open Space Economics? Be Prepared to be Surprised!
>>
>> Thanks Harrison,
>>
>> I think that perhaps we are not equally gifted as OS facilitators.
>> That said, for us more "mortal" facilitators, not noticing some
>> dynamic does not necessarily mean that it isn't there. I think it for
>> most of us, it is important to know it is (or can be) there, whether
>> we call it power or something else. If  I end up doing research on
>> group processes, OST will likely be just be one of several to be compared.
>>
>> Yes, there is an interested common belief that the world can be
>> managed. Much of the literature in my field (Organizational Behaviour)
>> is about "managing" people and finding the best way to control them
>> (I'm generalizing and simplifying here). I find it fascinating that in
>> this capitalist world, where the world supposedly is benefiting from
>> an "efficient market", management is still dominated by a belief based
>> on Taylorist and Fordist views of organization and production,
>> something that Stalin was an early adopter of. Why is it that when we
>> don't want to overly control society that we still want to overly
>> control organizations?
>>
>> I said a few years because it will take me a while before I get past
>> mandatory course work and comprehensive exams. :)
>>
>> Bui
>>
>> On 02/10/2013 3:57 PM, Harrison Owen wrote:
>>
>>     Bui – I surely hope that we will be seeing you sooner than a few
>>     years from now! And I have to say that nothing in my experience of
>>     multiple Open Spaces, including many with lots of CEOs, matches
>>     what you seem to be saying. To begin  with I have never seen an
>>     Open Space that didn’t work at all three levels of “work” that I
>>     would consider relevant. A) It works at a formal level – Folks sit
>>     in a circle, create bulletin board, open a market place and go to
>>     work. B) It works at a practical level – they actually get
>>     something done which they deem to be significant. C) It works at a
>>     continuing level – which for me means that at the minimum, even if
>>     they never do an Open Space again, and even if they immediately
>>     revert to their hierarchical, bureaucratic ways they always know
>>     that it could be better and different. I have had CEOs (and other
>>     execs) ask me if they should participate, fearing that their
>>     presence might be intimidating – To which my standard response is
>>     that they should do whatever they feel comfortable doing, but not
>>     to worry. I sometimes add that, presuming they have some value to
>>     add, their participation would be a plus. That usually causes a
>>     smile, and almost inevitably, active participation.
>>
>>     I confess I have heard tales of CEO’s who became so threatened
>>     that they stood in the middle and essentially told everybody what
>>     to do. In a word, they just shut off the lights. Perhaps my
>>     prejudices have gotten the better of me, but that doesn’t sound
>>     like a failure of Open Space, but rather a case of exceptionally
>>     bad manners and probably a severe personality disorder.
>>
>>     Perhaps one of the reasons I have never encountered a situation
>>     such as you describe is that I always insist on a conversation
>>     with the Senior Folks as a condition of contract. My friend Lisa
>>     might call this “pre-work,” but to me it has always been a
>>     relatively short simple conversation in which we go over a few
>>     essentials. First, the gathering will be voluntary (voluntary self
>>     selection).  Second, all issues of concern to anybody in the
>>     gathering will be on the table should they chose to put them
>>     there. If I detect any problem, that would be pretty much the end
>>     of the conversation, and my participation in their endeavor. Truth
>>     to tell in all my years I can only remember a single occasion
>>     where we ran into a deal breaker. And for whatever it is worth,
>>     that organization and those execs are now out of business. I
>>     wonder why?
>>
>>     The whole question of Executive control is a fascinating one, and
>>     should you pursue all this in your studies, you will have a rich
>>     field. >From where I sit,  the notion that any executive could
>>     exercise the sorts of control that many think they have, or
>>     perhaps hope they do (after all somebody must be in charge!) is
>>     flawed to say the least. They don’t have it, never did, and never
>>     will. The reason is simple. Any organization, large or small, is
>>     so enmeshed with an environment which is so fast moving,
>>     interconnected, random and chaotic that we can’t even think at
>>     that level. And what we can’t think, we surely can’t control.
>>     Mission Impossible.  Yes I know that there is this hope and
>>     expectation, fostered by the multiple business schools of the
>>     world that change can be managed, that the future can be
>>     predicted, indeed created, that the Plan will triumph. Lots of luck.
>>
>>     Harrison
>>
>>     Harrison Owen
>>
>>     7808 River Falls Dr.
>>
>>     Potomac, MD 20854
>>
>>     USA
>>
>>     189 Beaucaire Ave. (summer)
>>
>>     Camden, Maine 04843
>>
>>     Phone 301-365-2093
>>
>>     (summer) 207-763-3261
>>
>>     www.openspaceworld.com <www.openspaceworld.com%20>
>>
>>     www.ho-image.com <www.ho-image.com%20> (Personal Website)
>>
>>     To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives
>>     of OSLIST Go
>>     to:http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>>
>>     *From:*oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org
>>     <mailto:oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org>
>>     [mailto:oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org] *On Behalf Of *Bui
>>     Petersen
>>     *Sent:* Wednesday, October 02, 2013 11:23 AM
>>     *To:* World wide Open Space Technology email list
>>     *Subject:* Re: [OSList] Open Space Economics? Be Prepared to be
>>     Surprised!
>>
>>     Maybe "circumventing" is the wrong word. But for me the issue of
>>     power is central. In order for OST to work, the "CEO" has to
>>     temporarily give up some of her/his power (both procedural and
>>     positional).
>>
>>     I'm quite serious about this, and OST (and other group processes)
>>     may become part of my academic research (I just started on an PhD
>>     in Management). Maybe my contribution will be to help make the
>>     field of Management become more open to self-organization. :)
>>
>>     Maybe you'll all hear back from me in a few years. :)
>>
>>     Bui
>>
>>     On 02/10/2013 1:04 AM, Michael Herman wrote:
>>
>>         I can't ever remember "attempting to circumvent power
>>         dynamics," Bui.  While it's quite common when people talk
>>         about sitting in a circle they say things like, "...the circle
>>         makes everyone equal."  I always disagree.  The circle gives
>>         everyone equal access to all the others in the circle, the
>>         markers and paper and microphone at the center, and the
>>         bulletin board gives everyone the same access to all of the
>>         info that is generated.  It doesn't make them equal, the ceo
>>         has an entirely different set of skills, resources,
>>         experiences, concerns than the new intern.  But as a
>>         facilitator, I give everyone the same job:  learn and
>>         contribute as much as you can, from wherever you are, with
>>         whatever you have at your disposal.  serve the common purpose.
>>
>>         none of this attempts or requires any circumventing.  i think
>>         ost works in spite of whatever the power structure might be,
>>         once people show up.  maybe the invitation tweaks the power
>>         structure -- but if the invite comes from the top, then it's
>>         the top giving power away -- hardly a circumvention, and
>>         certainly not the facilitator attempting.  if the invite
>>         bubbles up from somewhere below, then it's the lower ranks
>>         claiming power for themselves.  so i think any shifting of
>>         power arises because invitation exists as an option, not
>>         because anything we do in the process of 'opening space.'  i
>>         think ost is just one way of pointing out that invitation is
>>         possible and the ost story is pretty much the same in all
>>         kinds of different "power" distributions.
>>
>>         or maybe i just don't understand.  what do you do to notice
>>         and recognize power imbalances?  and how have you seen this
>>         improve the ost experience for people?
>>
>>         m
>>
>>
>>
>>         --
>>
>>         Michael Herman
>>         Michael Herman Associates
>>         312-280-7838 (mobile)
>>
>>         http://MichaelHerman.com
>>         http://OpenSpaceWorld.org
>>
>>         On Tue, Oct 1, 2013 at 5:06 PM, Bui Petersen
>>         <bui.petersen at gmail.com <mailto:bui.petersen at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>>         Michael, I guess we'll have to disagree. I see OST's temporal
>>         attempt at circumventing power dynamics (e.g through the the
>>         empowered of the the law of two feet) as one of the beauties
>>         of the process.
>>
>>         One of the reasons that the liberal view of market economics
>>         is problematic is that it doesn't account for power
>>         imbalances. While you can't take away all structural power, I
>>         think the OST experience can be enhanced by at least some
>>         awareness and recognition of such powers.
>>
>>         Bui
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>         On 30/09/2013 10:56 PM, Michael Herman wrote:
>>
>>             i don't think ost is trying to "take away structural
>>             power," bui -- not even temporarily.  i think it's more
>>             about acknowledging the distribution of knowledge and
>>             choice (power) that already exists.  the law of two feet
>>             isn't something special we enact at the start of an event,
>>             it's something we just notice and point out, for instance.
>>
>>             m
>>
>>
>>
>>             --
>>
>>             Michael Herman
>>             Michael Herman Associates
>>             312-280-7838 <tel:312-280-7838> (mobile)
>>
>>             http://MichaelHerman.com
>>             http://OpenSpaceWorld.org
>>
>>             On Mon, Sep 30, 2013 at 10:21 AM, Bui Petersen
>>             <bui.petersen at gmail.com <mailto:bui.petersen at gmail.com>>
>>             wrote:
>>
>>             Interesting discussion. When I have described OST, some
>>             people have been skeptical as it to them has has sounded
>>             to "neo-liberal" and not taking power balances enough into
>>             consideration. Obviously what the "structure" of OST is
>>             trying to do is to take away structural power temporarily.
>>             But some people are still skeptical about OST's potential
>>             to do this. My own take is that OST does not always fully
>>             succeed in this regard.
>>
>>             Still it is very interesting theoretically. Both there is
>>             a lot of other (than economics) theoretical perspectives
>>             that better deal with power.
>>
>>             Bui
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>             On 26/09/2013 5:33 PM, Michael Herman wrote:
>>
>>                 I share your concerns, Jeff, but found this piece to
>>                 be mostly not about politics.  And where he comments
>>                 on current views and policy, I was less bothered by
>>                 what he was saying than by my tendency to agree in
>>                 many cases. But mostly this is interesting and useful
>>                 totally separate from his politics, I think.
>>
>>                 On Thursday, September 26, 2013, Jeff Aitken wrote:
>>
>>                 thanks Michael!
>>
>>                 It's unfortunate that I have a lingering dislike
>>                 for Mr. Gilder, who was famous for awhile around 1981
>>                 when the Reagan administration rolled out its economic
>>                 agenda, and his work was considered one of its
>>                 intellectual pillars.
>>
>>                 Twas a long time ago, and no doubt the man remains a
>>                 hard thinker and clear writer, perhaps with more heart
>>                 than I experienced back then.
>>
>>                 With that caveat, I'll dig into this when I have a
>>                 chance. Thanks for sharing.
>>
>>                 Jeff
>>
>>                 San Francisco
>>
>>                 On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 12:25 PM, Michael Herman
>>                 <michael at michaelherman.com
>>                 <mailto:michael at michaelherman.com>> wrote:
>>
>>                 Here's a long one, friends… But maybe an important one.
>>
>>                 What follows is an excerpt from a markets newsletter
>>                 I've read for maybe 10 years by a financial expert and
>>                 best-selling author Named John Mauldin.  He describes
>>                 and then shares an article by a guy named George
>>                 Gilder, Who seems to have been writing "important"
>>                 books for at least a few decades.
>>
>>
>>
>>                 --
>>                 Michael Herman
>>                 MichaelHerman.com
>>                 (312) 280-7838 <tel:%28312%29%20280-7838>
>>
>>                 Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>
>>
>>
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-- 
Michael M Pannwitz
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