[OSList] Conversation today with Brian Burt of MaestroConference

[Brian Burt]

Hey folks I'm just coming back from a week vacation and wow what a thread I
missed! :-)

I'm reading every word of it, and initially will reply just to the parts
addressed to me

> Question to Brian: are we also thinking video connections here? For how
many participants? I guess this would be an enormous task for the central
system in terms of bandwith and processing power. At the same time it would
add a lot to the experience.

We are planning to add that as well but timing on that is TBD as you're
right there are a lot of complications, and in general we want people to be
able to connect by phone as well as only with computers.

> I imagine important to you, Brian, so you do not call some new product by
a name that implies otherwise: When can it be called 'Open Space' and when
has it morphed to become some very lovely facilitated / interactive /
dialogic process - but no longer namable as 'Open Space'.

Totally agreed.  Our product now doesn't really handle the law of two feet
very well, and so while some use it that way, we'd want to make sure to be
able to do a "real" OS meeting before using that term in any way.

Lisa your list seems totally right on to me.

> i wonder, brian, are
you expecting to call this open space or something that fits into the
suite of titles that you already offer?

In the first phase I was thinking initially of an "Open Mode" (probably
avoiding "open space" in this phase) which respects the law of two feet for
breakouts.  Eventually we hope to have all the elements integrated (e.g.
Lisa's list) and then it would be an "Open Space Mode" assuming that term
isn't under licensing/copyright restrictions.

I reached out to Gabriela, and I am sure we'll have very different
solutions and choices to offer.  I welcome the conversation!

Koos your point about giving the context of someone who is holding space,
but not controlling the situation is very well taken.  I wonder if thoughts
on what that might look like visually?

Harold said:
>  I'm wanting to warn against attempting to "get it right" the first go.

We use Agile and in fact I spoke a couple weeks ago to the Bay Area Agile
Network, although that was about Holacracy (which I am a huge proponent of
since we've implemented it here BTW).

And you're also right on the nose about the first control being the law of
two feet ...

>  I agree with him, keep it simple - at first. I could definitely use
Maestro for Open Space if it only added a feature that lets people move
themselves to different rooms.

It sounds like our first Minimum Viable Product will work great for you! :-)

BTW, I do think at scale there are some subtleties about creating the
initial schedule - what happens when every person attending each want to
present a topic or even two (as seeming happened in a live open space at
Wisdom 2.0 which resulted in a fair amount of frustration I will add)?  How
do we combine and hone and filter so that the groups are of reasonable
size?  I'm wondering if there's a crowd-sourced rather than facilitator-led
way to create that schedule, especially at scale.  I welcome your thoughts!

-Brian

On Wed, Aug 29, 2012 at 12:46 PM, Koos de Heer <koos at auryn.nl> wrote:

>  Hi Suzanne:
>
> Yes, a rotating thing would be great, that would be a great way to deal
> with time zones. And it would not only cater for time zones, but also for
> different sleep/wake rythms.
>
> If you work with consecutive openings for different time zones, you could
> also have a recording ready of the most recent opening (or maybe all of
> them) that you could view before you enter the live conference, so you have
> an idea of what is going on and what the sesions are.
>
> I agree with you that a combination of visual marketplace and spoken
> topics would be great. I will do some more thinking of this visualization -
> it feels like a real challenge to create this and on the one hand putting
> all the information on the screen and on the other hand not making a mess
> of the screen interface.
>
> Question to Brian: are we also thinking video connections here? For how
> many participants? I guess this would be an enormous task for the central
> system in terms of bandwith and processing power. At the same time it would
> add a lot to the experience.
>
> Suddenly, I am thinking that in some way, we already have it. What we are
> doing here and now in this conversation (and others on this list) is an
> Open Space across time zones already. Through email - one of the oldest
> internet applications. It can be that simple...
>
> Koos
>
>
> At 21:17 29-8-2012, Suzanne Daigle wrote:
>
> Just jumping in after a quick read. This truly is exciting to imagine.
> Yes I agree with the compressed time frame (or time frames) and the
> dynamite energy it creates.  Considering the different time zones, an event
> could be designed such that space could be opened in a rotating schedule
> twice or three times with a host(s) and facilitator(s) opening the space in
> the traditional way in different parts of the world as if a continuous
> event over a 24 or 48 hour period. Breakout groups could be scheduled in
> the traditional way.  I can just imagine people from around the world
> joining in at different times. Lots of bumble beeing.
>
> Love having participants announcing their topics which is what we did with
> our adapted Global Conversation version of Open Space last November.
> Hearing people's voices from around the world announcing their topics and
> saying their names was truly magical, even more so because many attendees
> had never participated in a global event, had never experienced an Open
> Space and in some cases, never even been on a conference call.
> Everything happened relatively fast though it would have been so much
> better to have a visual marketplace wall as people spoke their topics.
>
> Suzanne
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Aug 29, 2012 at 12:57 PM, Koos de Heer <koos at auryn.nl> wrote:
>  Hi Michael!
>
> Good start! I can see that happening. At the same time, I wonder how far I
> would want to go with this stretched space-time thing. Open Space - in my
> experience - often has the character of a pressure cooker. A lot gets done
> in a short time and that is not only a great result in the end, but it also
> means a lot during the event. Already while the event is progressing,
> people say things like: something is really happening here! And they're
> thrilled to be a part of it and it increases the level of their
> contribution. Which in turn inspires and stimulates others as well.
>
> If you take out the element of limited time, I think you might lose this
> dynamic. Of course you can also go too far in the limiting of time. I once
> took part in an Open Space Online meeting where the time limit was enforced
> a little too strictly. This was back in the early days. When the time slot
> for a session ended, all the participants were kicked out of the session
> and the session was closed by the system. There was no "when it is over, it
> is over." It was more like: "It is over when the clock says it is over." So
> I would let the participants in a break out group deciede whether they are
> done or not. And I would make it very easy for all the participants to see
> at what time the other sessions will start.
>
> That is the nice thing about this technology. You don't have to walk over
> to the plenary room to go look at the agenda. You can have a side bar on
> your screen showing the sessions that are about to start, sorted by start
> time. You could even list the sessions there that are already running, to
> facilitate bumble beeing.
>
> To get back to Brian's questions: what we need to think about is how you
> are going to announce the topics. With online technology like this, you can
> easily let everyone post their session topics online and let them choose a
> time slot. The number of break out spaces is much more flexible than in a
> real building. But how do you get people to listen to the other topics that
> are listed and how do you get the topics spread out in time evenly? Not
> that you have to, but if all the sessions are at the beginning, the
> participants will be stretched really thin. And later on in the meeting
> there will not be many interesting sessions any more because all the good
> stuff was right at the start. I think I would like some sort of structure
> where those people who want to announce a topic have to line up for the
> microphone and they announce their topic to the entire audience one by one.
> Or is that too rigid? In a real meeting, you see people writing their
> topics and choosing time slots etc. If you are just waiting for your turn
> behind your computer, it can become quite lonely and boring. We would have
> to find a way to visualize what is going on. Like when you choose a time,
> you can see how many sessions there already are at each available start
> time. You could also have a visualization of the agenda wall that you see
> growing as sessions are added. And maybe an icon of a pen and paper next to
> someone's name if that person is in the process of entering a topic.
>
> Something to think about in the whole thing is what you would want to do
> by audio and what by typing or clicking ( not to speak of drawing and
> sharing what's on your screen). I am sure the folks at Maestro have some
> ideas about that already. But that was not the question at this point...
>
> This is really fun to play with!
>
> Koos
>
>
> At 15:09 29-8-2012, Michael Herman wrote:
>  logistics of topics and schedule...  first thoughts...
>
> i think it might work pretty much like it does when we're face to
> face.  there's one big group, a short briefing, and then a chance for
> anyone in the large group to post their name/topic.  i think there
> might be a host-designated grid of posting times, same as some people
> have done in the f2f meetings.
>
> now, the interesting wrinkle in what you're providing, brian, is that
> when we're not all in the same place and time, boxed in by plane
> rides, then the schedule grid could be set up to span days or weeks or
> even an ongoing series of conversations that don't end until the work
> does.  so the host-set starting grid might be one session long, today,
> or might stretch out indefinitely.
>
> so in this way, the "opening" is the session where this all gets
> briefed, oriented, trained, and set up, and then there is one or more
> breakouts.  in this way, future plenary sessions like evening and
> morning news sessions might still be evening and morning, or they
> might be week 1 news, week 2 news... or they might be january news or
> quarterly news.... but they'd all be able to be scheduled and take
> place in the same way any and all breakouts happen.  it might be good
> practice and worth prompting the host at set up to set one or more
> plenary times.  it might be set that no other sessions could be
> scheduled at those times, or that might be left for informal agreement
> within the group.  maybe it's a check box option for the host when
> setting those times.
>
> so there's an opening session.  where there is posting and announcing
> of sessions.  then breakouts which are a multiplication of the first
> session, with some sort of posting wall to support it.  there are
> specialized breakouts marked as plenaries.  and finally, a specialized
> plenary, marked as closing.  and while we're specializing, i wonder if
> being able to specify something like a "sub-theme" or "track" or maybe
> better a "stream" might allow for wider use and cross-pollination
> among projects or departments or other more fixed areas of focus, over
> the longer term, so that several open space streams in one group or
> organization might be flowing through the same schedule grid.  this
> might also support longer term complex projects in giving one layer of
> description between the main theme and the individual breakouts.
>
> this brings us to the point of taking notes, but that's beyond your
> question, i think.  <grin>
>
> one more thing... backing up a bit, brian... it might be helpful for
> people on the list here, who might be thinking about this and wanting
> to help, to hear from you a short description of what maestro
> conference provides now.  it's there in the website, on different
> pages and customer focused, but it'd be good to have even 3-5
> sentences that describes it from a functional perspective, "this is
> what it does now" sort of thing.
>
> m
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Michael Herman
> Michael Herman Associates
> 312-280-7838 (mobile)
>
> http://MichaelHerman.com
>  http://ManorNeighbors.com <http://manorneighbors.com/>
> http://OpenSpaceWorld.org
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Aug 29, 2012 at 4:12 AM, Brian Burt <brian.burt at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Thanks Harold.
> >
> >> I think if they would allow people to move themselves by some simple
> >> interface into the different rooms
> >
> > We definitely have that in mind and so appreciate people contributing
> with
> > hearts and minds
> >
> > Harold & All: How would you see the initial segment of collectively
> > brainstorming/proposing topics and landing on a schedule, especially with
> > hundreds (or more) of participants?  (pardon my ignorance of the terms)
> >
> > We'll be digging in later but I welcome more thoughts.
> >
> > Thank you,
> >
> > On Aug 24, 2012 9:38 PM, "Harold Shinsato" <harold at shinsato.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> Hi Suzanne,
> >>
> >> Thanks for pursuing this possibility with Maestro. I think I gave some
> >> input about this earlier. I find that the model that I experienced of
> >> Maestro conference was that it was optimized for people giving
> workshops who
> >> would then control the breakout groups.
> >>
> >> For Open Space, it doesn't seem to work well to put this decision making
> >> process into the hands of the facilitator. It loses the self-organizing
> >> feel.
> >>
> >> I think if they would allow people to move themselves by some simple
> >> interface into the different rooms - either with a web interface or by
> >> pressing numbers on the phone (like many people know to press *6 to mute
> >> themselves, something like *9 could give a prompt to ask for a room
> number)
> >> - you could cheaply and easily get the feeling of open space. Though I'd
> >> suggest having some experiments and then adjusting based on findings.
> >>
> >> I agree with Koos - the simpler the better. I also wonder if there is a
> >> "google hangout" method that could be used to combine voice and video.
> Could
> >> this be done already? How do you compete with free? In any case, please
> >> include me on the list of people interested. Thanks!
> >>
> >>     Regards,
> >>     Harold
> >>
> >>
> >> On 8/24/12 12:53 PM, Suzanne Daigle wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Hi Everyone,
> >>>
> >>> Thanks for being so responsive, brimming with ideas and information,
> love
> >>> the skepticism too!  It is so cool to learn about the work that has
> been
> >>> done over the years to develop an on-line virtual experience of Open
> Space.
> >>>
> >>> Brian Curt is on this list so he will be seeing these emails in real
> >>> time. I'm guessing others at MaestroConference may also be monitoring.
> >>>
> >>> Definitely we're not starting from scratch --much has been done and
> when
> >>> you add the powerful and unique features of MaestroConference with
> their
> >>> strategic vision to optimize their technology for Open Space, it gets
> even
> >>> more exciting. We may have the makings for something pretty darn great,
> >>> taking us, step by step, to the next level and bringing more Open
> Space to
> >>> the world -- a blend of  face-to-face and enhanced virtual.
> >>>
> >>> I don't know what y'all think and I don't mind tracking the names.  At
> >>> this "emergent" stage of the game, it would be wonderful if people
> continued
> >>> commenting as posts appear, sharing their thoughts and ideas. People
> could
> >>> also suggest who else should be part of these discussions. I know the
> >>> Agile/Scrum Technology community are very invested and aligned with
> Open
> >>> Space. Many OS trailblazers in that community for sure!
> >>>
> >>> It  might get chaotic, messy and a bit confusing. Yet if we keep the
> >>> conversations going, vibrant and chock-full of ideas and information,
> it
> >>> should lead to a dynamic theme and invitation for the MaestroConference
> >>> Virtual Open Visioning Event planned for the early Fall. No doubt we
> would
> >>> have a packed house and we'd certainly be getting a good headstart on
> things
> >>> while managing expectations knowing that we probably won't get this
> right
> >>> immediately.
> >>>
> >>> On my end, I just wanted to clarify the bit that I am doing -- being an
> >>> equal with all of you, highly receptive to what MaestroConference may
> be
> >>> envisioning,  keeping a list of names, "being prepared to be
> surprised",
> >>> doing less rather than more, and leaving lots of room for OS folks to
> >>> self-organize and share leadership on this wonderful project wherever
> it
> >>> leads.
> >>>
> >>> Suzanne
> >>>
> >>> P.S.  Brian and others at MaestroConference if you reading this, please
> >>> check out WOSonOS London (the annual World Open Space on Open Space is
> in
> >>> England this year) from October 11th to the 14th. (thanks Spark!)  We
> would
> >>> love to see you!  Many seasoned Open Space practitioners attending from
> >>> across the globe.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Fri, Aug 24, 2012 at 12:08 PM, Thomas Herrmann
> >>> < thomas at openspaceconsulting.com> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> Hi Suzanne
> >>>>
> >>>> Great idea!
> >>>>
> >>>> I have done quite a lot of virtual facilitation the last years and
> have
> >>>> found a software that gives most of the possibilities that I think are
> >>>> needed ­ even if I have only used it with quite small groups. Several
> of the
> >>>> people in the Genuine Contact community use it ­ Blackboard
> Collaborate.
> >>>> After testing many many available software we found this which suits
> the
> >>>> needs for participative meetings incl Open Space, very well incl
> >>>> reliability.
> >>>>
> >>>> I am willing to share some of my experiences down the line.
> >>>>
> >>>> Hugs
> >>>>
> >>>> Thomas Herrmann
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Från: oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org
> >>>> [ mailto:oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org<oslist-bounces at lists.openspacetech.org>]
> För Suzanne Daigle
> >>>> Skickat: den 24 augusti 2012 04:50
> >>>> Till: World wide Open Space Technology email list
> >>>> Ämne: [OSList] Conversation today with Brian Burt of MaestroConference
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Exciting to imagine! A virtual interface specifically geared to Open
> >>>> Space. Brian Burt, CEO and Founder of MaestroConference, and I were
> on the
> >>>> phone for about 30 minutes this afternoon.  It was a “jump right in”
> kinda
> >>>> conversation with lots of give and take.  No doubt about it,
> >>>> MaestroConference has been giving this some thought and Brian Burt
> knows the
> >>>> process, principles and language of Open Space.
> >>>>
> >>>> In some cases their technology is there and stuff could happen right
> >>>> away; other things need to be figured out and then of course, you
> can’t
> >>>> totally replicate an in-person experience of Open Space so a hybrid
> virtual
> >>>> adaptation would need to be developed.
> >>>>
> >>>> We talked about the big picture of a Virtual Open Space Social Webinar
> >>>> platform that would allow hundreds and even thousands of people to
> >>>> participate. We also discussed some of the challenges; for example:
> “can you
> >>>> really have a virtual conversation with 50 people on-line engaged in
> one
> >>>> topic or would we need to break into smaller groups” and “how could we
> >>>> manage a post-it board with time and place”.
> >>>>
> >>>> Brian’s plan, along with other folks at Maestro Conference, is to
> host a
> >>>> Virtual Open Visioning Event this Fall inviting lots of people (it
> would be
> >>>> terrific if many joined) from the Open Space community and folks in
> the
> >>>> technology world (major users of Open Space) to engage in working
> >>>> conversations around the interface, the implementation, the
> applications of
> >>>> where and how a virtual OS could be used, the invitation process and
> so much
> >>>> more.
> >>>>
> >>>> What I was able to convey to Brian is that there are many
> practitioners
> >>>> in this worldwide OS community, including the OSI US Board, who are
> >>>> interested and excited about having a virtual Open Space platform.
> I’ll be
> >>>> the first to say that I’m not the expert (nor the leader) in that
> regard but
> >>>> I certainly have the passion and am willing to roll up my sleeves with
> >>>> others to help make it happen.
> >>>>
> >>>> At Brian’s request, I’ve agreed to lend a hand if people want to
> advise
> >>>> off list that they are interested, feel free to email me. You can
> also do it
> >>>> publicly on the OS list and I’ll keep track. MaestroConference is also
> >>>> interested in knowing if anyone has people they’d recommend who
> should be
> >>>> invited to the Fall Event.
> >>>>
> >>>> In anticipation of the Virtual Open Visioning Event being planned,
> >>>> perhaps we can continue the conversations on our OS list sharing what
> we
> >>>> would hope to see, what questions we have, how we may want to
> contribute to
> >>>> this  effort. My specific interest related to the virtual technology
> is
> >>>> having the ability to host post-events after a face-to-face Open
> Space,
> >>>> continuing the conversations and driving some of the actions and
> initiatives
> >>>> that participants identified.
> >>>>
> >>>> An early Call to Action that may help Maestro Conference in their
> >>>> planning! What do y'all think?
> >>>>
> >>>> Suzanne
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Suzanne Daigle
> >>>> NuFocus Strategic Group
> >>>> 7159 Victoria Circle
> >>>> University Park, FL 34201
> >>>> FL 941-359-8877;
> >>>> CT 203-722-2009
> >>>> www.nufocusgroup.com
> >>>> s.daigle at nufocusgroup.com
> >>>> twitter @suzannedaigle
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> OSList mailing list
> >>>> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
> >>>> To unsubscribe send an email to OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
> >>>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
> >>>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Suzanne Daigle
> >>> NuFocus Strategic Group
> >>> 7159 Victoria Circle
> >>> University Park, FL 34201
> >>> FL 941-359-8877;
> >>> CT 203-722-2009
> >>> www.nufocusgroup.com
> >>> s.daigle at nufocusgroup.com
> >>> twitter @suzannedaigle
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> OSList mailing list
> >>> To post send emails to OSList at lists.openspacetech.org
> >>> To unsubscribe send an email to OSList-leave at lists.openspacetech.org
> >>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
> >>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Harold Shinsato
> >> harold at shinsato.com
> >> http://shinsato.com
> >> twitter: @hajush
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
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> >>
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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>
>
>
> --
> Suzanne Daigle
> NuFocus Strategic Group
> 7159 Victoria Circle
> University Park, FL 34201
> FL 941-359-8877;
> CT 203-722-2009
> www.nufocusgroup.com
> s.daigle at nufocusgroup.com
> twitter @suzannedaigle
>
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>


-- 
=================================
Brian Burt
Founder and CEO, MaestroConference
The Leader in Social Conferencing (tm)
415-727-1820 direct + mobile
877-414-1515 office
brian at maestroconference.com
=================================
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