finding a quote
Allison & Jim Baensch
mbody at iinet.net.au
Mon Nov 19 15:23:33 PST 2007
You beauty, Harrison,
Thank you for that.
Deb Hartman kindly pointed me to the spot for your quote.
My eyes were spinning this morning by the time I tried to find it.
So it was great to have Deb's prompt and your simple suggestion.
Together, you both took all the foof out of my flumox.
Now I feel much more like a self-organising system.
Not sane, however, but then I dropped my aspirations towards sanity
many years ago.
Trying to be sane was too depressing for me.
Its rewards didn't match the effort involved.
Now I allow mainly open space to fill the gap between my ears.
(Except when I misplace a quote, with a deadline looming, of course.)
Allison.
On 20/11/2007, at 9:31 AM, Harrison Owen wrote:
> Well you sort of got me. I know the author. Nobody would talk like
> that
> except me. And you may question the wisdom of all that. But as to the
> citation, I am not sure. Given the date, I would say "The Power of
> Spirit:
> How Organizations Transform" (Berrett-Koehler). On the other hand I
> don't
> remember saying anything like that in "Spirit" -- But I do recall
> something
> to the same effect in, "The Practice of Peace"(Human Systems Dynamics
> Institute). But in the interest of your sanity (to say nothing of
> protecting
> me from charges of loosing my own) -- I think you can safely
> attribute it to
> "Harrison Owen -- personal communication." Always works when I get
> into a
> tight spot. :-)
>
> Harrison
>
> Harrison Owen
> 7808 River Falls Drive
> Potomac, Maryland 20854
> Phone 301-365-2093
> Skype hhowen
> Open Space Training www.openspaceworld.com
> Open Space Institute www.openspaceworld.org
> Personal website www.ho-image.com
> OSLIST: To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the
> archives Visit: www.listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html
>
>
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>From Mon Nov 19 19:59:09 2007
Message-Id: <MON.19.NOV.2007.195909.0500.>
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 19:59:09 -0500
Reply-To: 76066.515 at compuserve.com
To: OSLIST <OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU>
From: douglas germann <76066.515 at compuserve.com>
Subject: Re: funding community work?
In-Reply-To: <LISTSERV%200711151744557912.61A1 at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU>
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Raffi--
Thank you for all your questions. They are good ones.
The one that speaks to me the most is what do we mean by community work?
I think Harrison's answer about what work he was doing is best
(paraphrased): I haven't the slightest idea, but I know I must do it!
:- Doug.
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>From Mon Nov 19 20:04:35 2007
Message-Id: <MON.19.NOV.2007.200435.0500.>
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 20:04:35 -0500
Reply-To: 76066.515 at compuserve.com
To: OSLIST <OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU>
From: douglas germann <76066.515 at compuserve.com>
Subject: Re: more funding community work?
In-Reply-To: <CAE9138210DFA3419D6492967D65992404A5EF17 at LIMBO.snvworld.corp>
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Stuart--
Could you say a little more on these two things please:
1. action oriented enquiry (sounds like it might be related to the work
of Fran Peavey, http://www.crabgrass.org/ )
2. use of imagery to surface unvoiced or unarticulated agendas
Oh, and to bring the query full circle, how do you fund this community
work? <grin>
Thanks, Stuart!
:- Doug.
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>From Mon Nov 19 20:27:29 2007
Message-Id: <MON.19.NOV.2007.202729.0500.>
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 20:27:29 -0500
Reply-To: 76066.515 at compuserve.com
To: OSLIST <OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU>
From: douglas germann <76066.515 at compuserve.com>
Subject: Re: more funding community work?
In-Reply-To: <D9533DDF-9438-11DC-A9AA-00039376847C at napuk.demon.co.uk>
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Harrison, Kerry, Peggy, Jeff, Raffi and all--
Sorry to have gone quiet on all of you...but you did it to me.
Your responses on this topic have sent me off into silence to ponder the
meaning of it all.
Harrison, following your nose sounds like such a small thing, but it is
profound. It tells me I have to be more willing to risk telling the
story of conversation and open space.
As Peggy asks, is there a money trail in that scent somewhere, enough
that will support the work that needs doing?
Kerry, I do not know if there is a Roundtree-like foundation in the US,
but I suspect there are several. Perhaps someone can help us pinpoint
some likely suspects. Anyone?
You say "Public decision making and politics clearly are failing" and
this reminds me of something Len Traubman (of Living Room Dialogues)
says of the peace process, dialogue and building connections between
peoples--that it is something of which governments are incapable.
So let's take your idea, Kerry, a half step further: Let us package
conversation as the forgotten key to the great human work, and then find
a champion who will help match it up to funding sources. (Are there
people who do this?) Or find some worthy cause which is looking for an
effective way to engage people in its work and partner.
:- Doug.
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>From Mon Nov 19 20:45:02 2007
Message-Id: <MON.19.NOV.2007.204502.0500.>
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 20:45:02 -0500
Reply-To: 76066.515 at compuserve.com
To: OSLIST <OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU>
From: douglas germann <76066.515 at compuserve.com>
Subject: Re: Sharing Resources (was 'Facilitator as space-invader!')
In-Reply-To: <001301c8295f$02c58470$6401a8c0 at Lisa>
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Lisa--
On Sat, 2007-11-17 at 13:15 -0800, Lisa Heft wrote:
>
> This also goes under the title of ‘Funding Community Work’ –
>
>
>
> I never offer my work for free and I never offer free scholarships to
> my workshops – but instead, everybody pays what they can.
>
>
>
> For my clients – we have a conversation about possible costs, then
> every client gets to set their own fee for my services, according to
> their financial abilities. The big guys pay the big bucks, the other
> guys pay the most that they can given their own particular financial
> circumstances.
>
>
>
> For my workshops – there are suggested levels of payment, including a
> ‘pay your own price’ where participants get to set their own level of
> fee for registration. Every price is right – anything over zero. So
> everybody can afford the workshop.
>
> In these ways, it all evens out – those who can pay more are putting
> money into the ‘pool’ to help cover those with less resources.
>
>
>
> It always works.
One might say, Whatever you can afford to pay is the right amount!
I am really becoming enamored of this way of "pricing."
Lisa, do you have any unusual sources of funding you have seen in
Community work?
:- Doug.
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>From Mon Nov 19 18:25:25 2007
Message-Id: <MON.19.NOV.2007.182525.0800.>
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 18:25:25 -0800
Reply-To: lisaheft at openingspace.net
To: OSLIST <OSLIST at LISTSERV.BOISESTATE.EDU>
From: Lisa Heft <lisaheft at openingspace.net>
Subject: Re: More funding community work?
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Doug, you wrote in your response to my 'name your own price' approach -
=20
<One might say, Whatever you can afford to pay is the right amount!>
=20
Yep, it is an extension of the "Whoever comes is the right person" - I =
want
to make it as easy as possible for the 'right people' to be able to get
there.
=20
It is also operating out of a theory of abundance.
=20
<Lisa, do you have any unusual sources of funding you have seen in =
Community
work?>
=20
In my world, the 'unusual' source of funding I describe above is usual.
=20
I think just like 'selling' Open Space, it can be hard to sell funding =
for
these kinds of things before people themselves see a need, and it does =
not
usually make sense to 'sell' based on a process or a tool you will use. =
So
as it seems to work best when we do this work for specific reasons, the =
only
thing I can think of is to seek specific funding for particular
issues/groups from funders who fund just exactly that sort of thing - =
just
as NGOs research grants and say 'here is a proposal that fits into your
funding criteria'. Perhaps there are some funders who will understand =
the
value of funding dialogue and democracy - I know that several =
foundations
are funding this sort of thing around the world - as a tool for getting
things done (like engaging a community in identifying issues and
opportunities in their region, to tell potential candidates before an
election in an emerging democracy country). Funders typically need a =
lot of
advance notice (to fit things into a pre-set funding calendar). So =
perhaps
it like funding anything - researching who funds something similar, when
their funding cycles are, what are the criteria for funding and how does
your event fit into that, and so on.
=20
There are announce lists (I can't recall their names) you can get on to
receive weekly reports of funding opportunities - though be careful, =
because
a number of them are just for projects in a certain country (like the =
USA).
Then you just look at those over time (and they link you to other =
funding
sites and keep doing your research) to see where there is a fit. This =
can
be a many-hours-per-week job.
=20
I think grant writing and seeking sponsors is a special art.
=20
You might link with an experienced grant writer-researcher to let them =
know
the thing you are interested in, have them research and write grants =
(with
you) and if you cannot pay them a salary as they go, perhaps give them a
percentage / build in a line item cost to pay them for the grants you =
get /
the work they have done - though that last approach would mean that this
individual has another source of income for themselves while you are all
waiting for the funding to come.
=20
Otherwise, I think the source of financial support is often from funders =
who
have experienced, seen and felt OS for themselves.
=20
I think it is challenging to come from outside the system to try to sell =
/
convince about something rather than have someone within the system (the
communities you wish to serve) identifying their interest or need. So I
would think that this seeking perhaps should be done in partnership with =
the
people you are trying to serve.=20
=20
Not a direct answer to your 'unusual source' question, just some random
thoughts...
=20
Ted and Michael H - you have created events where you have invited =
funders -
what sorts of results or actions from funders or =
funder-participant-group
partnerships have come of these? Perhaps that would inform our =
conversation
here...
=20
Lisa
=20
___________________________
L i s a H e f t
Consultant, Facilitator, Educator
O p e n i n g S p a c e
<mailto:lisaheft at openingspace.net> lisaheft at openingspace.net
<http://www.openingspace.net> www.openingspace.net=20
=20
*
*
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<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'>Doug, you wrote in your response to =
my ‘name
your own price’ approach -</span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'> </span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoPlainText style=3D'text-indent:.5in'><font size=3D2 =
face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt'><<i><span style=3D'font-style:italic'>One =
might say,
Whatever you can afford to pay is the right =
amount</span></i>!></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoPlainText><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt'> </span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoPlainText><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt'>Yep, it is an extension of the “Whoever comes is the right =
person”
– I want to make it as easy as possible for the ‘right =
people’
to be able to get there.</span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoPlainText><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt'> </span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoPlainText><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt'>It is also operating out of a theory of =
abundance.</span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoPlainText><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt'> </span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoPlainText style=3D'text-indent:.5in'><font size=3D2 =
face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt'><<i><span =
style=3D'font-style:italic'>Lisa, do you
have any unusual sources of funding you have seen in Community =
work</span></i>?></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'> </span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'>In my world, the =
‘unusual’
source of funding I describe above is usual.</span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'> </span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'>I think just like =
‘selling’ Open
Space, it can be hard to sell funding for these kinds of things before =
people themselves
see a need, and it does not usually make sense to ‘sell’ =
based on a
process or a tool you will use. So as it seems to work best when =
we do
this work for specific reasons, the only thing I can think of is to seek
specific funding for particular issues/groups from funders who fund just
exactly that sort of thing – just as NGOs research grants and say =
‘here
is a proposal that fits into your funding criteria’. Perhaps =
there
are some funders who will understand the value of funding dialogue and
democracy – I know that several foundations are funding this sort =
of
thing around the world – as a tool for getting things done (like =
engaging
a community in identifying issues and opportunities in their region, to =
tell
potential candidates before an election in an emerging democracy =
country).
Funders typically need a lot of advance notice (to fit things into a =
pre-set
funding calendar). So perhaps it like funding anything –
researching who funds something similar, when their funding cycles are, =
what
are the criteria for funding and how does your event fit into that, and =
so on.</span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'> </span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'>There are announce lists (I =
can’t
recall their names) you can get on to receive weekly reports of funding =
opportunities
– though be careful, because a number of them are just for =
projects in a
certain country (like the USA). Then you just look at those over =
time
(and they link you to other funding sites and keep doing your research) =
to see
where there is a fit. This can be a many-hours-per-week =
job.</span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'> </span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'>I think grant writing and seeking =
sponsors
is a special art.</span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'> </span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'>You might link with an experienced =
grant
writer-researcher to let them know the thing you are interested in, have =
them research
and write grants (with you) and if you cannot pay them a salary as they =
go,
perhaps give them a percentage / build in a line item cost to pay them =
for the
grants you get / the work they have done – though that last =
approach would
mean that this individual has another source of income for themselves =
while you
are all waiting for the funding to come.</span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'> </span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'>Otherwise, I think the source of =
financial support
is often from funders who have experienced, seen and felt OS for =
themselves.</span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'> </span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'>I think it is challenging to come =
from
outside the system to try to sell / convince about something rather than =
have someone
within the system (the communities you wish to serve) identifying their
interest or need. So I would think that this seeking perhaps =
should be
done in partnership with the people you are trying to serve. =
</span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'> </span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'>Not a direct answer to your =
‘unusual
source’ question, just some random thoughts...</span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'> </span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'>Ted and Michael H – you have =
created
events where you have invited funders – what sorts of results or =
actions
from funders or funder-participant-group partnerships have come of =
these?
Perhaps that would inform our conversation here...</span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'> </span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'>Lisa</span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Trebuchet MS"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'> </span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dblack face=3D"Trebuchet =
MS"><span
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet =
MS";color:black'>___________________________</span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><b><font size=3D2 color=3Dblue face=3D"Trebuchet =
MS"><span
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet =
MS";color:blue;font-weight:bold'>L
i s a H e f t</span></font></b></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dblue face=3D"Trebuchet =
MS"><span
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet =
MS";color:blue'>Consultant,
Facilitator, Educator</span></font></p>
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i n
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